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So Slack didn't bother building with `rtc_use_pipewire=true` and that's Wayland's problem? Complain to Slack.
by vetinari 6y ago
So Slack didn't bother building with `rtc_use_pipewire=true` and that's Wayland's problem?
Complain to Slack.
- rcxdude 6y agoSupport from popular apps absolutely is a problem for the platform. It might not be caused by them, but it is their problem. The user doesn't care who's fault it is, they're just going to go with the combination which works for them.
- vetinari 6y agoWhile I agree, that support for popular apps is a problem for platform, it doesn't mean that the platform will freeze for every snowflake app. Apple for example regularly uses pressure from users on app authors to drive improvements in their platform. I don't see why Linux distributions should flip backward to keep their platform static, to the detriment of their long term development.
- zamadatix 6y agoPipewire is still 0.x as of today, let alone when they last tried it, so I don't think anybody should be going to Slack like they were too lazy to build it "right". Besides even if it was built with that the screensharing via pipewire isn't at feature parity with normal screen/monitor/window level sharing so it's not a 1:1 drop in quite yet. Wayland said screen sharing is something to be solved outside of Wayland itself. That solution is still early and not complete. It's not anybody's problem, it's just how things are. It'll get fixed eventually, in the meantime X11 still runs fine for most users and in 6-12 months switching to Wayland should have fewer tradeoffs. Until then Wayland is missing some use cases X11 easy fulfills. Unfortunately X11 is also missing many use cases Wayland fills. As a result we should expect different users to be better served by different answers about how ready a Wayland environment is for them and both to be equally correct.
- vetinari 6y agoYes, Pipewire is at 0.3 today; but that's not a problem. Pipewire has the ambition to replace Pulseaudio, Jack and provide APIs for several other subject, not just screen grabbing. That's the part that is missing toward 1.0. Screengrabbing during the last year was even better than what X11 could provide, including the ability for the user to limit the grabbing to display or window. That's something that user cannot have under control in X11. Pipewire is also not limited to Wayland; it will work with X11 too, so the X11 users won't be abandoned just because there's Wayland support too. Firefox doesn't seem to have problem with it, Chrome has it behind flags. For apps with fast moving releases as these, I don't see any problem with them supporting 0.3 release and when/if there is API breaks, updating it. Beats not supporting screen sharing under Wayland at all.
- zamadatix 6y agoPipewire is definitely the right path when things are complete but right now you have to build with a beta version of Electron with build flags and rutime flags to use a 0.x version of Pipewire and when you do it currently only presents the option to capture the full screen. I.e. it's not that the tech stack or architecure is the wrong it's simply not done yet and not done to the point it's a bit silly to blame Slack for not enabling it. It's also not the fault of wayland/pipewire/chromium/electron/slack for not all simultaneously releasing working screen sharing but it is a mistake to say you can switch from X11 to <Wayland stack> and not worry about screen sharing. I use pipewire for screen sharing, I like it, but its not a fully baked stack and won't be for some time yet.
- vetinari 6y ago> only presents the option to capture the full screen Are you sure? I'm pretty sure I had two tabs, one for picking displays and other for picking windows. Pretty much like this: https://bug1675764.bmoattachments.org/attachment.cgi?id=9186238 https://bug1675764.bmoattachments.org/attachment.cgi?id=9186...
- 6y ago
- utxaa 6y agocomplaining won't help me join a meeting.