4 ms·

Revolut has stopped trading GME and AMC

74 points by powerandr 6y ago

dt3ft 6y ago
Getting 500: Internal Server Error.
- reaperducer 6y ago
  Getting 500: Internal Server Error. Mild irony on a .io domain.
  - frenchy 6y ago
    I'm not following, why would a 500 be ironic from site with a domain that belongs to a bunch of islands in the Indian Ocean that the Brits seem to think they own.
    - reaperducer 6y ago
      Are you under the impression that people on HN buy .io domains because they're fans of the Indian Ocean, and not to evoke the tech term "input/output?" Do you also believe that Google bought .dev because the guy who runs the TLD is named Devon?
- pmlnr 6y ago
  I wonder when will people learn to always set up at least microcaching, because you can never know when the ~slashdot effect~ hug of hackernews will hit you.
  - devmunchies 6y ago
    Question, if using NGINX with static HTML would caching still be necessary? I'm assuming something like wordpress where it hits the database on every request is where you'd want microcaching.
    - jhaile 6y ago
      Probably not, although caching in memory is still faster than disk access. More commonly sites that fail under load are dynamically building pages, hitting DB, etc. though.
- drocer88 6y ago
  Alternate source for Revolut and GME news: https://conservativeinvestingnews.com/2021/02/02/gamestop-buyers-suffer-another-setback-as-revolut-bans-trading/ https://conservativeinvestingnews.com/2021/02/02/gamestop-bu... "British financial technology startup, Revolut stopped users from investing any further in Texas-based video game retailer GameStop and movie theatre chain AMC. The challenger app attributed the move to new restrictions imposed by their technology provider, the US broker-dealer, DriveWealth, LLC."
LatteLazy 6y ago
Yet more evidence is a clearing and collateral issue, not a massive conspiracy...
- delaaxe 6y ago
  Conspiracy just shifted to the clearing side
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
    - another_sock 6y ago
      Nonresponsive
  - LatteLazy 6y ago
    Of course. No conspiracy is ever disproven. If we proved the CIA didn't kill JFK, plenty of people would just reply that we were part of it! Or it was Mosad and they framed the CIA (those bastards!) It's no different to any other religious belief.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- devmunchies 6y ago
  con•spir•a•cy [noun] - A secret plan by a group to do something unlawful or harmful. Going by the definition, you're right. Not a conspiracy since they aren't hiding it, they're brazen.
- justapassenger 6y ago
  Conspiracy claims are from people who have no idea how financial market works, and just bought their first stock last week, because of the hype. It’s like someone buying their first computer, and saying it’s government conspiracy that it crashed, after they’ve installed random software from a link they got in spam.
jstanley 6y ago
A friend is seeing a message from Revolut saying that the reason is due to increased capital requirements, and not something they have done of their own volition. > Trading Update for GME and AMC > Unfortunately, our broker-dealer in the US, DriveWealth, can no longer offer Buys on GameStop (NYSE: GME) and AMC Entertainment (NYSE: AMC) due to increased capital requirements set by the Depository Trust Company (DTC) in the US. > While we apologise for the inconvenience this may cause, this is not a decision Revolut has made. As DriveWealth is our broker-dealer, we can only reflect the stocks they make available. We will however keep you informed as and when this situation changes. > For customers with no holdings in these 2 stocks, neither GME nor AMC will appear in search. Please check the email we are sending out to all Revolut Trading Ltd customers for additional information about this situation. > Capital at risk. Share prices can go up as well as down and you may get back less than what you initially paid.
- Hamuko 6y ago
  Isn't that what Robinhood was also saying?
  - jstanley 6y ago
    Yes.
  - belval 6y ago
    After a while yes, what caused the initial issue was their initial press release that made no mention of not having enough money to cover transactions for GME/AMC. They said it was to "protect their users", which is what triggered the widespread outrage.
  - anonu 6y ago
    RH does their own custody & clearing, so the DTCC was telling them directly what type of collateral they needed to post. Companies like Revolut outsource this function to DriveWealth, which coincidentally are the backend for many trading-focused fintechs. So there is 1 level of indirection. On the other hand - not too clear why everyone is claiming some massive conspiracy. There are rules around liquidity and collateral and they are directly tied to volatility of a stock.
hankchinaski 6y ago
From Revolut > Hi, From today, we will only be able to facilitate the selling of GameStop (NYSE: GME) and AMC Entertainment (NYSE: AMC) stocks for the time being. Unfortunately, our broker-dealer in the US, DriveWealth, can no longer offer Buys on these stocks due to increased capital requirements set by the Depository Trust Company (DTC) in the US. What does this mean for me? You can only sell out your existing holdings in these stocks. Any outstanding buy orders on these two symbols made after Monday’s (1 February) close will automatically be cancelled prior to market open on 2 February, 2021. None of our other stocks are affected at this time and are available to trade as normal. For customers with no holdings in these 2 stocks, neither GME, nor AMC will appear when searched. This is a standard practice when a position moves to sell only, as we don't want to show you stocks you’re not able to buy at that time. As soon as they become available to buy again, you’ll be able to see them in the app. Why is this happening? When a stock is traded, it takes two days for the proceeds to go from the broker to the clearing house. This is known as T+2 settlement. Within this time, the clearing house requires the broker to front cash or capital guarantees to ensure funds are available through the settlement process. The required amount of capital is usually around 10-15% of the value of a security’s holdings on broker’s books. However, this percentage can vary based on stock volatility. In the case of GME and AMC, the DTC has enforced an increase of capital requirements by 250% upon DriveWealth’s clearing partners. This increase means that DriveWealth is now obligated to restrict trading in GME and AMC, as stock has its own capital requirement rather than a broker wide requirement. When will they be available again to buy? This is not a decision Revolut has made, simply one that we are obligated to carry out. We are monitoring the situation very closely and will update you when our partner, DriveWealth, re-enables Buys for GME and AMC. We apologise for any inconvenience caused. Team Revolut
- anonu 6y ago
  A smart fintech platform would allow customers to post their own cash collateral. For every $1 you trade you need $2.50 in cash in your account, which we sweep at the end of the day.
vmception 6y ago
If only there was some technology to prove settlement occurred, an eansy tiny bit faster than 2 business days, so that brokers don't have to come up with their own additional capital to clear other people's trades.
- kchr 6y ago
  Yeah, they need to replace those carrier pigeons with something more akin to an interconnected, world-wide network of sorts... Hmmm
tanto 6y ago
Can someone explain to me how the volume of GME compares to the FAANG stocks? How can a few retail investors create such an impact that clearing houses are hitting limits compared to the daily amount of value traded on the top 100 caps. I mean we have the SEC watching over everything so I am sure there is nothing shady going on here. /s Seriously: Can someone explain as I would like to understand it? 5-day volume AAPL 121,284,172 * 135$ 5-day volume GME 58,017,305 * 119$ https://www.barchart.com/stocks/quotes/AAPL/technical-analysis https://www.barchart.com/stocks/quotes/AAPL/technical-analys... https://www.barchart.com/stocks/quotes/GME/technical-analysis https://www.barchart.com/stocks/quotes/GME/technical-analysi...
- Jommi 6y ago
  You have to first realize that the market doesn't work in vacuum. These are not just retail investors, it's a lot of actors.
powerandr 6y ago
Sorry guys, my bluehost site crashed here is my vid: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1d2bB1PfSTI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1d2bB1PfSTI
syntaxing 6y ago
I don’t really get the advantage of RH or Revolut compared to Fidelity or Vanguard. I mean in terms of UI/UX, the Fidelity app is on par to RH (maybe RH is slightly better). Why not trade using a company that is more reliable and trustworthy?
- anonu 6y ago
  Like many things in tech: first mover isnt always a winning strategy. Many people had free trading before RH. RH just did it better with a mobile-first gamified experience. The same dopamine hit you get from sharing or liking on social media, well you get that when your net worth just went up by a few pennies. The RH UI/UX enforced this gambling-like environment. A killer product would have brought something like r/wsb+RH into 1 app- focus on sharing your "gain porn".
blobbers 6y ago
Hint: if something is free, you might be paying for it in other ways. The collateral obligations to run a brokerage are a real thing and these under capitalized brokerages are messing with the market. There's a reason the big boys trade through the prime brokerage. The carpet got pulled out from under the Robinhood because there's a game going on that they didn't even know they were in. Robinhood meanwhile is collecting fat lending fees for lending out the GME shares all their "diamond hands" members are holding.
alak 6y ago
Not a big surprise, since the Revolut CEO is a piece of shit!

74 points by powerandr 6y ago

dt3ft 6y ago

Getting 500: Internal Server Error.

reaperducer 6y ago
Getting 500: Internal Server Error. Mild irony on a .io domain.
- frenchy 6y ago
  I'm not following, why would a 500 be ironic from site with a domain that belongs to a bunch of islands in the Indian Ocean that the Brits seem to think they own.
  - reaperducer 6y ago
    Are you under the impression that people on HN buy .io domains because they're fans of the Indian Ocean, and not to evoke the tech term "input/output?" Do you also believe that Google bought .dev because the guy who runs the TLD is named Devon?
pmlnr 6y ago
I wonder when will people learn to always set up at least microcaching, because you can never know when the ~slashdot effect~ hug of hackernews will hit you.
- devmunchies 6y ago
  Question, if using NGINX with static HTML would caching still be necessary? I'm assuming something like wordpress where it hits the database on every request is where you'd want microcaching.
  - jhaile 6y ago
    Probably not, although caching in memory is still faster than disk access. More commonly sites that fail under load are dynamically building pages, hitting DB, etc. though.
drocer88 6y ago
Alternate source for Revolut and GME news: https://conservativeinvestingnews.com/2021/02/02/gamestop-buyers-suffer-another-setback-as-revolut-bans-trading/ https://conservativeinvestingnews.com/2021/02/02/gamestop-bu... "British financial technology startup, Revolut stopped users from investing any further in Texas-based video game retailer GameStop and movie theatre chain AMC. The challenger app attributed the move to new restrictions imposed by their technology provider, the US broker-dealer, DriveWealth, LLC."

LatteLazy 6y ago

Yet more evidence is a clearing and collateral issue, not a massive conspiracy...

delaaxe 6y ago
Conspiracy just shifted to the clearing side
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
  - another_sock 6y ago
    Nonresponsive
- LatteLazy 6y ago
  Of course. No conspiracy is ever disproven. If we proved the CIA didn't kill JFK, plenty of people would just reply that we were part of it! Or it was Mosad and they framed the CIA (those bastards!) It's no different to any other religious belief.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
devmunchies 6y ago
con•spir•a•cy [noun] - A secret plan by a group to do something unlawful or harmful. Going by the definition, you're right. Not a conspiracy since they aren't hiding it, they're brazen.
justapassenger 6y ago
Conspiracy claims are from people who have no idea how financial market works, and just bought their first stock last week, because of the hype. It’s like someone buying their first computer, and saying it’s government conspiracy that it crashed, after they’ve installed random software from a link they got in spam.

jstanley 6y ago

A friend is seeing a message from Revolut saying that the reason is due to increased capital requirements, and not something they have done of their own volition. > Trading Update for GME and AMC > Unfortunately, our broker-dealer in the US, DriveWealth, can no longer offer Buys on GameStop (NYSE: GME) and AMC Entertainment (NYSE: AMC) due to increased capital requirements set by the Depository Trust Company (DTC) in the US. > While we apologise for the inconvenience this may cause, this is not a decision Revolut has made. As DriveWealth is our broker-dealer, we can only reflect the stocks they make available. We will however keep you informed as and when this situation changes. > For customers with no holdings in these 2 stocks, neither GME nor AMC will appear in search. Please check the email we are sending out to all Revolut Trading Ltd customers for additional information about this situation. > Capital at risk. Share prices can go up as well as down and you may get back less than what you initially paid.

Hamuko 6y ago
Isn't that what Robinhood was also saying?
- jstanley 6y ago
  Yes.
- belval 6y ago
  After a while yes, what caused the initial issue was their initial press release that made no mention of not having enough money to cover transactions for GME/AMC. They said it was to "protect their users", which is what triggered the widespread outrage.
- anonu 6y ago
  RH does their own custody & clearing, so the DTCC was telling them directly what type of collateral they needed to post. Companies like Revolut outsource this function to DriveWealth, which coincidentally are the backend for many trading-focused fintechs. So there is 1 level of indirection. On the other hand - not too clear why everyone is claiming some massive conspiracy. There are rules around liquidity and collateral and they are directly tied to volatility of a stock.

hankchinaski 6y ago

From Revolut > Hi, From today, we will only be able to facilitate the selling of GameStop (NYSE: GME) and AMC Entertainment (NYSE: AMC) stocks for the time being. Unfortunately, our broker-dealer in the US, DriveWealth, can no longer offer Buys on these stocks due to increased capital requirements set by the Depository Trust Company (DTC) in the US. What does this mean for me? You can only sell out your existing holdings in these stocks. Any outstanding buy orders on these two symbols made after Monday’s (1 February) close will automatically be cancelled prior to market open on 2 February, 2021. None of our other stocks are affected at this time and are available to trade as normal. For customers with no holdings in these 2 stocks, neither GME, nor AMC will appear when searched. This is a standard practice when a position moves to sell only, as we don't want to show you stocks you’re not able to buy at that time. As soon as they become available to buy again, you’ll be able to see them in the app. Why is this happening? When a stock is traded, it takes two days for the proceeds to go from the broker to the clearing house. This is known as T+2 settlement. Within this time, the clearing house requires the broker to front cash or capital guarantees to ensure funds are available through the settlement process. The required amount of capital is usually around 10-15% of the value of a security’s holdings on broker’s books. However, this percentage can vary based on stock volatility. In the case of GME and AMC, the DTC has enforced an increase of capital requirements by 250% upon DriveWealth’s clearing partners. This increase means that DriveWealth is now obligated to restrict trading in GME and AMC, as stock has its own capital requirement rather than a broker wide requirement. When will they be available again to buy? This is not a decision Revolut has made, simply one that we are obligated to carry out. We are monitoring the situation very closely and will update you when our partner, DriveWealth, re-enables Buys for GME and AMC. We apologise for any inconvenience caused. Team Revolut

anonu 6y ago
A smart fintech platform would allow customers to post their own cash collateral. For every $1 you trade you need $2.50 in cash in your account, which we sweep at the end of the day.

vmception 6y ago

If only there was some technology to prove settlement occurred, an eansy tiny bit faster than 2 business days, so that brokers don't have to come up with their own additional capital to clear other people's trades.

kchr 6y ago
Yeah, they need to replace those carrier pigeons with something more akin to an interconnected, world-wide network of sorts... Hmmm

tanto 6y ago

Can someone explain to me how the volume of GME compares to the FAANG stocks? How can a few retail investors create such an impact that clearing houses are hitting limits compared to the daily amount of value traded on the top 100 caps. I mean we have the SEC watching over everything so I am sure there is nothing shady going on here. /s Seriously: Can someone explain as I would like to understand it? 5-day volume AAPL 121,284,172 * 135$ 5-day volume GME 58,017,305 * 119$ https://www.barchart.com/stocks/quotes/AAPL/technical-analysis https://www.barchart.com/stocks/quotes/AAPL/technical-analys... https://www.barchart.com/stocks/quotes/GME/technical-analysis https://www.barchart.com/stocks/quotes/GME/technical-analysi...

Jommi 6y ago
You have to first realize that the market doesn't work in vacuum. These are not just retail investors, it's a lot of actors.

powerandr 6y ago

Sorry guys, my bluehost site crashed here is my vid: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1d2bB1PfSTI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1d2bB1PfSTI

syntaxing 6y ago

I don’t really get the advantage of RH or Revolut compared to Fidelity or Vanguard. I mean in terms of UI/UX, the Fidelity app is on par to RH (maybe RH is slightly better). Why not trade using a company that is more reliable and trustworthy?

anonu 6y ago
Like many things in tech: first mover isnt always a winning strategy. Many people had free trading before RH. RH just did it better with a mobile-first gamified experience. The same dopamine hit you get from sharing or liking on social media, well you get that when your net worth just went up by a few pennies. The RH UI/UX enforced this gambling-like environment. A killer product would have brought something like r/wsb+RH into 1 app- focus on sharing your "gain porn".

blobbers 6y ago

Hint: if something is free, you might be paying for it in other ways. The collateral obligations to run a brokerage are a real thing and these under capitalized brokerages are messing with the market. There's a reason the big boys trade through the prime brokerage. The carpet got pulled out from under the Robinhood because there's a game going on that they didn't even know they were in. Robinhood meanwhile is collecting fat lending fees for lending out the GME shares all their "diamond hands" members are holding.

alak 6y ago

Not a big surprise, since the Revolut CEO is a piece of shit!