4 ms·

Yikes! I have no experience or knowledge regarding Wayland, infact this post was the first I have heard of it. That being said, if the author's rant truly refl

Yikes! I have no experience or knowledge regarding Wayland, infact this post was the first I have heard of it. That being said, if the author's rant truly reflects the attitude of the community, it's sounds pretty toxic.

Shared404 6y ago
Standing as an outside observer, usually when someone posts about progress on Wayland they are immediately greeted by "Well, I don't like it." "That sucks" "just use X" etc. I've seen that sometimes here, although it's more frequent on Reddit.
- oceliker 6y ago
  I mean, that's just internet in general, isn't it?
  - bluGill 6y ago
    Yes, and it is frustrating to those doing real work, in all incarnations. I try to not contribute, but even knowing about the problem I catch myself - it seems to be human nature.
- sigmaprimus 6y ago
  It's really a shame how that happens, it is pretty much a universal problem. I have seen people get into physical fights and shouting matches IRL charitable organizations where everyone is volunteering their time. The OP's feelings are probably justified and I can empathize with them but the rant was still jarring and probably won't have any impact on the haters but will affect others. Just my thoughts, maybe I'm virtue signaling a bit too much.
geofft 6y ago
I don't know that it does - the author has, as far as I can tell, three small commits in Wayland: https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/wayland/-/commits/master?author=Drew%20DeVault https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/wayland/-/commits/mas...
- Shared404 6y ago
  He also maintains wlroots, which is the base for basically every non-gnome(and KDE?) Wayland compositor/WM.
  - geofft 6y ago
    Ah, thanks! That makes more sense and that explains the "we".
  - sgift 6y ago
    Not anymore: https://drewdevault.com/2020/10/23/Im-handing-wlroots-and-sway-to-Simon.html https://drewdevault.com/2020/10/23/Im-handing-wlroots-and-sw...
  - Quekid5 6y ago
    I'm 99% certain that KDE has it's own full compositor implementation for Wayland.
  - tbr1 6y ago
    He also wrote "the book" on the subject: https://wayland-book.com/ https://wayland-book.com/
mncharity 6y ago
> if the author's rant truly reflects the attitude of the community, it's sounds pretty toxic. There's been a lot of external hostility and conflict over the years. Which unsurprisingly affects community culture. And the reverse too. I recall encountering surprising "yikes!" even early on, from excursions from professionalism, tone-deafness, and groupthink. Which didn't help with external harmony. It might be interesting to explore sometime, what might have been done differently long-term, to perhaps have gotten different dynamics. For instance, if replacing X11 had been envisioned as first a broadening of alternatives, and only then a narrowing to a new standard. Open source often uses forking and competing projects to defuse hostility and keep people engaged and productive. Coping gracefully with "lots of diverse everyone trapped on the same boat" isn't its strength.

Shared404 6y ago

Standing as an outside observer, usually when someone posts about progress on Wayland they are immediately greeted by "Well, I don't like it." "That sucks" "just use X" etc. I've seen that sometimes here, although it's more frequent on Reddit.

oceliker 6y ago
I mean, that's just internet in general, isn't it?
- bluGill 6y ago
  Yes, and it is frustrating to those doing real work, in all incarnations. I try to not contribute, but even knowing about the problem I catch myself - it seems to be human nature.
sigmaprimus 6y ago
It's really a shame how that happens, it is pretty much a universal problem. I have seen people get into physical fights and shouting matches IRL charitable organizations where everyone is volunteering their time. The OP's feelings are probably justified and I can empathize with them but the rant was still jarring and probably won't have any impact on the haters but will affect others. Just my thoughts, maybe I'm virtue signaling a bit too much.

geofft 6y ago

I don't know that it does - the author has, as far as I can tell, three small commits in Wayland: https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/wayland/-/commits/master?author=Drew%20DeVault https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/wayland/-/commits/mas...

Shared404 6y ago
He also maintains wlroots, which is the base for basically every non-gnome(and KDE?) Wayland compositor/WM.
- geofft 6y ago
  Ah, thanks! That makes more sense and that explains the "we".
- sgift 6y ago
  Not anymore: https://drewdevault.com/2020/10/23/Im-handing-wlroots-and-sway-to-Simon.html https://drewdevault.com/2020/10/23/Im-handing-wlroots-and-sw...
- Quekid5 6y ago
  I'm 99% certain that KDE has it's own full compositor implementation for Wayland.
- tbr1 6y ago
  He also wrote "the book" on the subject: https://wayland-book.com/ https://wayland-book.com/

mncharity 6y ago

> if the author's rant truly reflects the attitude of the community, it's sounds pretty toxic. There's been a lot of external hostility and conflict over the years. Which unsurprisingly affects community culture. And the reverse too. I recall encountering surprising "yikes!" even early on, from excursions from professionalism, tone-deafness, and groupthink. Which didn't help with external harmony. It might be interesting to explore sometime, what might have been done differently long-term, to perhaps have gotten different dynamics. For instance, if replacing X11 had been envisioned as first a broadening of alternatives, and only then a narrowing to a new standard. Open source often uses forking and competing projects to defuse hostility and keep people engaged and productive. Coping gracefully with "lots of diverse everyone trapped on the same boat" isn't its strength.