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I really miss the network transparency in Wayland. Just being able to start a program on another machine through an SSH session is so useful. You can use someth

I really miss the network transparency in Wayland. Just being able to start a program on another machine through an SSH session is so useful. You can use something like vnc but a "whole desktop in a window" is slower and not as handy. I'm on freebsd mostly anyway which isn't big on the Wayland train so I'm fine for now. But it would be great if X11 development would be continued.

nullifidian 6y ago
Windows subsystem for linux literally uses RDP and wayland for single windows as its graphics subsystem. Single windows aren't a problem and "network transparency" through remote procedure calls is just anachronistic, and will never support things like animations, 3d, or video.
Redoubts 6y ago
> You can use something like vnc but a "whole desktop in a window" is slower Really? I’ve found x-forwarding much slower and annoying unless the host is on a LAN.
- zbuf 6y ago
  I think you've probably answered the question there; there are a lot of hosts on my LAN. X works great.
  - GekkePrutser 6y ago
    Yeah even on my cloud boxes it works great. They are physically close though. Ideally if X was still maintained they could incorporate some of the old freeNX / X2go logic that makes it more robust against latency. But I think this usecase is becoming more important again. In the early days of X it was great because we were all using terminals on single powerful machines. Then we moved to desktop and transparency was less of a thing. But now we're moving more and more towards cloud computing again which is not all that different from the old client/server model. At least not in the sense of having a separation between compute and I/O.
- galangalalgol 6y ago
  Agreed, my workflow is a workspace with firefox with jira gitlab etc. open. Then a few with terminals and vscode open, several of those are often vscode running on remote machines via x forwarding. Then I develop on one box that is a couple vpn hops away and its too slow for forwarding. I hate it though because I have to switch to that workspace, fullscreen the window, and then when I'm done, esc the vnc and switch to another workspace. If there is a wayland way to have just firefox or just vscode running remotely that would solve my concern.
zbuf 6y ago
> I'm on freebsd mostly anyway which isn't big on the Wayland train so I'm fine for now. But it would be great if X11 development would be continued. It would be. If a group wishes to take up Xorg development then I would be supportive of that. I suspect it may come from the BSDs, too.
- GekkePrutser 6y ago
  Yeah I hope so. It's not in a good place with RedHat right now because they want to get rid of it anyway. This way it becomes obsolete even quicker, it's a self-fulfilling prophecy. I really hope some group will take it on board that really wants it. I think there's still a good usecase for it. FreeBSD does support Wayland in a way but it's pretty primitive.

nullifidian 6y ago

Windows subsystem for linux literally uses RDP and wayland for single windows as its graphics subsystem. Single windows aren't a problem and "network transparency" through remote procedure calls is just anachronistic, and will never support things like animations, 3d, or video.

Redoubts 6y ago

> You can use something like vnc but a "whole desktop in a window" is slower Really? I’ve found x-forwarding much slower and annoying unless the host is on a LAN.

zbuf 6y ago
I think you've probably answered the question there; there are a lot of hosts on my LAN. X works great.
- GekkePrutser 6y ago
  Yeah even on my cloud boxes it works great. They are physically close though. Ideally if X was still maintained they could incorporate some of the old freeNX / X2go logic that makes it more robust against latency. But I think this usecase is becoming more important again. In the early days of X it was great because we were all using terminals on single powerful machines. Then we moved to desktop and transparency was less of a thing. But now we're moving more and more towards cloud computing again which is not all that different from the old client/server model. At least not in the sense of having a separation between compute and I/O.
galangalalgol 6y ago
Agreed, my workflow is a workspace with firefox with jira gitlab etc. open. Then a few with terminals and vscode open, several of those are often vscode running on remote machines via x forwarding. Then I develop on one box that is a couple vpn hops away and its too slow for forwarding. I hate it though because I have to switch to that workspace, fullscreen the window, and then when I'm done, esc the vnc and switch to another workspace. If there is a wayland way to have just firefox or just vscode running remotely that would solve my concern.

zbuf 6y ago

> I'm on freebsd mostly anyway which isn't big on the Wayland train so I'm fine for now. But it would be great if X11 development would be continued. It would be. If a group wishes to take up Xorg development then I would be supportive of that. I suspect it may come from the BSDs, too.

GekkePrutser 6y ago
Yeah I hope so. It's not in a good place with RedHat right now because they want to get rid of it anyway. This way it becomes obsolete even quicker, it's a self-fulfilling prophecy. I really hope some group will take it on board that really wants it. I think there's still a good usecase for it. FreeBSD does support Wayland in a way but it's pretty primitive.