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> But the U.S. is not much different here The US is profoundly different. Very few developed countries have at-will employment. It puts immigrants at risk of

> But the U.S. is not much different here The US is profoundly different. Very few developed countries have at-will employment. It puts immigrants at risk of being fired and losing health insurance in any moment and with 0 warning. This creates a very exploitative environment. Not to mention how difficult it is to immigrate, or to get a green card or citizenship compared to many other countries.

pelasaco 6y ago
> Not to mention how difficult it is to immigrate, or to get a green card or citizenship compared to many other countries Compared with which countries?
- f6v 6y ago
  Germany. 21 months working on a Blue Card gets you the right to apply for an unlimited permanent residence. And the Blue Card is rather trivial to get. All you need is a degree and a contract with a company. No visa sponsorship required, i.e. it costs a German company 0 to hire someone outside the EU. I think Canada’s express entry is a good example as well.
  - pelasaco 6y ago
    > All you need is a degree and a contract with a company. That's just possible for some markets. If you are talking about your own experience, that's because you are probably software developer. Canada and Australia are definitely not easier, but more transparent.
    - f6v 6y ago
      https://www.make-it-in-germany.com/en/visa/skilled-immigration-act https://www.make-it-in-germany.com/en/visa/skilled-immigrati... It's still a good deal. Non-IT professionals can get a PR status in 4 years.
  - baybal2 6y ago
    Big asterisk there. German education accreditation for Blue Card is rather fickle. Germany maintains a rather short list of universities per-country which it recognises as institutes of higher learning. You may have a rather ordinary uni degree in mainstream occupation, but if your uni is not on the list, you can't do anything. If you passed a university program in a recognised university, but your program is missing from a dropdown list on their website, again, you can't do anything. And if you have both, but your degree does not state in its title verbatim that it is a bachelor, or masters program regardless of years of study, again, you can't do anything about it.
    - f6v 6y ago
      > you can't do anything. You're right, that happened to me in 2014. My then-employer had to drive to some government office and ask them to give a go-ahead for my degree. But I've never heard anything like that since that time.
beyondcompute 6y ago
Good point. But the healthcare situation is a different topic.
- eeZah7Ux 6y ago
  It's not.
sokoloff 6y ago
“Nobody goes there any more; it’s too crowded.” At-will employment has pros and cons. It’s not like citizens have permanent employment contracts and immigrants have at-will arrangements. Employers are more willing to hire if firing someone who doesn’t work out isn’t ruinous for the employer. It’s true that someone who emigrates from a country where they have a permanent employment arrangement is giving something up to come to the US. Presumably, they think it’s worth it.
dgellow 6y ago
> Very few developed countries have at-will employment. And no other country than the US has 0 paid vacation days and 0 paid public holydays! The other day I was checking number of paid vacations per country, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_minimum_annual_leave_by_country https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_minimum_annual_leave_b..., the US is the only country ns the world with 0 total paid leave.
- danans 6y ago
  > And no other country than the US has 0 paid vacation days and 0 paid public holydays! The vast majority of US states do not even guarantee any paid sick leave. https://www.patriotsoftware.com/blog/payroll/state-mandated-paid-sick-leave-laws/ https://www.patriotsoftware.com/blog/payroll/state-mandated-... All together this has the effect of increasing employers' leverage over employees, especially in industries with limited jobs and lots of competition for them.

pelasaco 6y ago

> Not to mention how difficult it is to immigrate, or to get a green card or citizenship compared to many other countries Compared with which countries?

f6v 6y ago
Germany. 21 months working on a Blue Card gets you the right to apply for an unlimited permanent residence. And the Blue Card is rather trivial to get. All you need is a degree and a contract with a company. No visa sponsorship required, i.e. it costs a German company 0 to hire someone outside the EU. I think Canada’s express entry is a good example as well.
- pelasaco 6y ago
  > All you need is a degree and a contract with a company. That's just possible for some markets. If you are talking about your own experience, that's because you are probably software developer. Canada and Australia are definitely not easier, but more transparent.
  - f6v 6y ago
    https://www.make-it-in-germany.com/en/visa/skilled-immigration-act https://www.make-it-in-germany.com/en/visa/skilled-immigrati... It's still a good deal. Non-IT professionals can get a PR status in 4 years.
- baybal2 6y ago
  Big asterisk there. German education accreditation for Blue Card is rather fickle. Germany maintains a rather short list of universities per-country which it recognises as institutes of higher learning. You may have a rather ordinary uni degree in mainstream occupation, but if your uni is not on the list, you can't do anything. If you passed a university program in a recognised university, but your program is missing from a dropdown list on their website, again, you can't do anything. And if you have both, but your degree does not state in its title verbatim that it is a bachelor, or masters program regardless of years of study, again, you can't do anything about it.
  - f6v 6y ago
    > you can't do anything. You're right, that happened to me in 2014. My then-employer had to drive to some government office and ask them to give a go-ahead for my degree. But I've never heard anything like that since that time.

beyondcompute 6y ago

Good point. But the healthcare situation is a different topic.

eeZah7Ux 6y ago
It's not.

sokoloff 6y ago

“Nobody goes there any more; it’s too crowded.” At-will employment has pros and cons. It’s not like citizens have permanent employment contracts and immigrants have at-will arrangements. Employers are more willing to hire if firing someone who doesn’t work out isn’t ruinous for the employer. It’s true that someone who emigrates from a country where they have a permanent employment arrangement is giving something up to come to the US. Presumably, they think it’s worth it.

dgellow 6y ago

> Very few developed countries have at-will employment. And no other country than the US has 0 paid vacation days and 0 paid public holydays! The other day I was checking number of paid vacations per country, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_minimum_annual_leave_by_country https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_minimum_annual_leave_b..., the US is the only country ns the world with 0 total paid leave.

danans 6y ago
> And no other country than the US has 0 paid vacation days and 0 paid public holydays! The vast majority of US states do not even guarantee any paid sick leave. https://www.patriotsoftware.com/blog/payroll/state-mandated-paid-sick-leave-laws/ https://www.patriotsoftware.com/blog/payroll/state-mandated-... All together this has the effect of increasing employers' leverage over employees, especially in industries with limited jobs and lots of competition for them.