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How far do people get sticking to first-party packages? I inevitably end up, like, wanting to have videogames or newer development tools or something. I guess d

How far do people get sticking to first-party packages? I inevitably end up, like, wanting to have videogames or newer development tools or something. I guess developers might be outliers, but even my work laptop ships with distro-managed browser versions that the work-managed SSO login form rejects as too old, so pretty much everybody has a non-distro-packaged browser install.

m45t3r 6y ago
I don't know any distro that doesn't update browser packages in stable releases. Fedora, Ubuntu, Arch (ok, Arch is rolling release but still) and NixOS at least offer the lastest versions of Firefox and Chromium on its repository. Debian too, but I think they package Firefox ESR instead of Firefox release.
- ben0x539 6y ago
  Yeah, it's an ESR, but the SSO thing specifically wants a recent version and not ESR. Not pretending that's a good decision, but I still have to go along.
atomicnumber3 6y ago
IME: Organizations just standardize on one thing. CentOS (but not anymore I guess v.v) or RHEL or Ubuntu or Debian etc. Pick an LTS and then install it on all the work-provided hardware and just make sure everything works for your org. For individuals, (and by that I mean me and like a few of my friends who run GNU+Linux) it's something like: 1. Docker 2. Use Arch Linux Personally, my setup is: Machine I use as a PC run Arch so everything is just latest vanilla upstream. My homelab is ostensibly Ubuntu LTS, but I run docker on almost every host, and have a Proxmox host too, so the Ubuntu layer directly on the machine only really gets used for running ping, dig and nmap (and docker of course).
opan 6y ago
If you use a rolling release distro, stuff stays pretty up-to-date. For games, there are usually free software titles packaged. Minetest, Xonotic, StepMania, Cataclysm: Dark Days Ahead, Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup, Nethack, Red Eclipse, Super Tux Kart...
michaelmrose 6y ago
There are many solutions to the same problem. ================================================== A rolling release distro suffers from that problem vastly less than a rolling release since you will usually have current versions of most tools if your distro has enough people to maintain it. See gentoo, funtoo, arch, manjaro, void. Making it easy to produce alternative package repos goes a long way towards having people actually make them. See overlays in gentoo/funtoo and ppas in ubuntu and ubuntu based distros like mint. This is especially important in ubuntu which is not rolling and can be different degrees of out of date especially if you use the long term support versions. Making it easy to produce a package goes a long way towards it being easy to make one even if its only used by yourself. Arch/Manjaro Funtoo/Gentoo packages are both very easy. Gentoo/Funtoo use flags make it easy to build an alternative version of a package eliminating the need to build it because the distro maintainer didn't enable the feature you need. Arch's AUR makes it easy to add a package that can also be produced from source and updated like any other package via aur helper. Can also have alternative builds of the same package. Of many distros I have used over time I would say that on Arch and Funtoo I didn't have to build anything manually but I did rely on the AUR and overlays + made a package for funtoo which was very very easy. On mint and ubuntu I ended up with about a million ppas + building some things. On net I'd say that rolling release + a system where users can trivially create their own packages on something like the AUR is the most versatile while still being accessible. Funtoo was even more flexible but substantially more complicated. However for various reasons I'm using Void now and have only 2 manually build things. Gargoyle because its not in the repo and I hadn't figured out how to make a package and mpv with a sndio partch.
usr1106 6y ago
I have have worked over 10 years Linux only. I have never needed to install a different browser. Sometimes I needed Skype telcos with some customers, recently I needed Zoom for some training. Both have .deb packages that worked. Occasionally I needed some developer tools, but they were generally Linux-friendly and did not cause any trouble. Yes, I am nowadays selective with what employer I would join. If their IT department is Windows-focussed they are not for me. That greatly limits choice, but reduces daily frustration efficiently.

m45t3r 6y ago

I don't know any distro that doesn't update browser packages in stable releases. Fedora, Ubuntu, Arch (ok, Arch is rolling release but still) and NixOS at least offer the lastest versions of Firefox and Chromium on its repository. Debian too, but I think they package Firefox ESR instead of Firefox release.

ben0x539 6y ago
Yeah, it's an ESR, but the SSO thing specifically wants a recent version and not ESR. Not pretending that's a good decision, but I still have to go along.

atomicnumber3 6y ago

IME: Organizations just standardize on one thing. CentOS (but not anymore I guess v.v) or RHEL or Ubuntu or Debian etc. Pick an LTS and then install it on all the work-provided hardware and just make sure everything works for your org. For individuals, (and by that I mean me and like a few of my friends who run GNU+Linux) it's something like: 1. Docker 2. Use Arch Linux Personally, my setup is: Machine I use as a PC run Arch so everything is just latest vanilla upstream. My homelab is ostensibly Ubuntu LTS, but I run docker on almost every host, and have a Proxmox host too, so the Ubuntu layer directly on the machine only really gets used for running ping, dig and nmap (and docker of course).

opan 6y ago

If you use a rolling release distro, stuff stays pretty up-to-date. For games, there are usually free software titles packaged. Minetest, Xonotic, StepMania, Cataclysm: Dark Days Ahead, Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup, Nethack, Red Eclipse, Super Tux Kart...

michaelmrose 6y ago

There are many solutions to the same problem. ================================================== A rolling release distro suffers from that problem vastly less than a rolling release since you will usually have current versions of most tools if your distro has enough people to maintain it. See gentoo, funtoo, arch, manjaro, void. Making it easy to produce alternative package repos goes a long way towards having people actually make them. See overlays in gentoo/funtoo and ppas in ubuntu and ubuntu based distros like mint. This is especially important in ubuntu which is not rolling and can be different degrees of out of date especially if you use the long term support versions. Making it easy to produce a package goes a long way towards it being easy to make one even if its only used by yourself. Arch/Manjaro Funtoo/Gentoo packages are both very easy. Gentoo/Funtoo use flags make it easy to build an alternative version of a package eliminating the need to build it because the distro maintainer didn't enable the feature you need. Arch's AUR makes it easy to add a package that can also be produced from source and updated like any other package via aur helper. Can also have alternative builds of the same package. Of many distros I have used over time I would say that on Arch and Funtoo I didn't have to build anything manually but I did rely on the AUR and overlays + made a package for funtoo which was very very easy. On mint and ubuntu I ended up with about a million ppas + building some things. On net I'd say that rolling release + a system where users can trivially create their own packages on something like the AUR is the most versatile while still being accessible. Funtoo was even more flexible but substantially more complicated. However for various reasons I'm using Void now and have only 2 manually build things. Gargoyle because its not in the repo and I hadn't figured out how to make a package and mpv with a sndio partch.

usr1106 6y ago

I have have worked over 10 years Linux only. I have never needed to install a different browser. Sometimes I needed Skype telcos with some customers, recently I needed Zoom for some training. Both have .deb packages that worked. Occasionally I needed some developer tools, but they were generally Linux-friendly and did not cause any trouble. Yes, I am nowadays selective with what employer I would join. If their IT department is Windows-focussed they are not for me. That greatly limits choice, but reduces daily frustration efficiently.