4 ms·

Yes, agreed. It’s embarrassing for the UK... my point was that there is no example of a western, liberal country not being an island that was able to reach zero

by baxtr 6y ago

Yes, agreed. It’s embarrassing for the UK... my point was that there is no example of a western, liberal country not being an island that was able to reach zero Covid. It’s just way easier as an island state.

gridspy 6y ago
New Zealand is about as large as Europe. Larger than the UK. https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2019/08/map-how-nz-and-europe-compare-when-it-comes-to-land-mass.html https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2019/08/map-how-n...
- baxtr 6y ago
  With no borders to other countries
- KineticLensman 6y ago
  But not a major transit hub, miles from anywhere, low density population
  - gridspy 6y ago
    Being a transit hub is irrelevant if the people in transit do not mix with those out of transit. Keep the (potentially) sick people on the "air side" of the airport terminal and then directly into quarantines on arrive at the final destination. Those who bridge this gap (air crews, terminal staff) need to follow very strict measures (PPE, cleaning, regular testing) to make that work. Perhaps more places need to decide they don't want to be a major transit hub during this pandemic? You know, restrict non-essential traffic a bit to make the essential traffic and local populace safer?
    - KineticLensman 6y ago
      > Being a transit hub is irrelevant Well, if your country isn't a transit hub, then you avoid hub problems completely. If you are a hub, then you have additional problems that New Zealand doesn't, that you have to work to mitigate.
- votepaunchy 6y ago
  The EU is 16x the size of NZ.
threeseed 6y ago
This island nonsense needs to stop. All of the European countries were able to implement border controls as the Schengen Borders Code permits. They easily could have had a mandatory 2-week quarantine for all foreign approvals and had a similar result to Australia and New Zealand. They chose instead to mimic themselves after Sweden and opted to contain rather than eliminate the virus. Even now Macron refuses to impose a lockdown.
- baxtr 6y ago
  I am just referring to facts here. I am sorry if you don’t like them. There is no western country not being an island that has zero COVID. It’s a fact don’t you agree? If you agree we can now discuss if this is just a coincidence or if it has something to do with political realities
  - josephg 6y ago
    There's also no western nation that tried NZ/Aus's "go early, go hard" policy of lockdowns and didn't reach 0 local cases. Maybe the real difference is that we're an island. But much more likely is our different public policies. And if you need evidence, the UK is an island (like Aus/NZ) with policies more like the US and - surprise! They have case numbers more similar to the US than similar to Aus/NZ. If you really think the island / continent thing is relevant, I'm excited to hear the story of why the US's covid disaster is somehow actually canada and mexico's fault.
    - baxtr 6y ago
      I think you have it backwards. I never said being an Island will save you, see the UK. Still the fact remains that there is no other Western country which is no Island that has zero Covid. If you accept this fact we can start discussing the underlying reasons. Maybe it’s because they’re islands, and maybe you’re right and it’s because of the policy in place. I believe it’s the former, because it’s way more difficult to control influx of people in a connected economy like the EU for example. It’s basically like saying the state of New York could have been able to drive COVID down to zero while other states had it exploding.

by baxtr 6y ago

gridspy 6y ago

New Zealand is about as large as Europe. Larger than the UK. https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2019/08/map-how-nz-and-europe-compare-when-it-comes-to-land-mass.html https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2019/08/map-how-n...

baxtr 6y ago
With no borders to other countries
KineticLensman 6y ago
But not a major transit hub, miles from anywhere, low density population
- gridspy 6y ago
  Being a transit hub is irrelevant if the people in transit do not mix with those out of transit. Keep the (potentially) sick people on the "air side" of the airport terminal and then directly into quarantines on arrive at the final destination. Those who bridge this gap (air crews, terminal staff) need to follow very strict measures (PPE, cleaning, regular testing) to make that work. Perhaps more places need to decide they don't want to be a major transit hub during this pandemic? You know, restrict non-essential traffic a bit to make the essential traffic and local populace safer?
  - KineticLensman 6y ago
    > Being a transit hub is irrelevant Well, if your country isn't a transit hub, then you avoid hub problems completely. If you are a hub, then you have additional problems that New Zealand doesn't, that you have to work to mitigate.
votepaunchy 6y ago
The EU is 16x the size of NZ.

threeseed 6y ago

This island nonsense needs to stop. All of the European countries were able to implement border controls as the Schengen Borders Code permits. They easily could have had a mandatory 2-week quarantine for all foreign approvals and had a similar result to Australia and New Zealand. They chose instead to mimic themselves after Sweden and opted to contain rather than eliminate the virus. Even now Macron refuses to impose a lockdown.

baxtr 6y ago
I am just referring to facts here. I am sorry if you don’t like them. There is no western country not being an island that has zero COVID. It’s a fact don’t you agree? If you agree we can now discuss if this is just a coincidence or if it has something to do with political realities
- josephg 6y ago
  There's also no western nation that tried NZ/Aus's "go early, go hard" policy of lockdowns and didn't reach 0 local cases. Maybe the real difference is that we're an island. But much more likely is our different public policies. And if you need evidence, the UK is an island (like Aus/NZ) with policies more like the US and - surprise! They have case numbers more similar to the US than similar to Aus/NZ. If you really think the island / continent thing is relevant, I'm excited to hear the story of why the US's covid disaster is somehow actually canada and mexico's fault.
  - baxtr 6y ago
    I think you have it backwards. I never said being an Island will save you, see the UK. Still the fact remains that there is no other Western country which is no Island that has zero Covid. If you accept this fact we can start discussing the underlying reasons. Maybe it’s because they’re islands, and maybe you’re right and it’s because of the policy in place. I believe it’s the former, because it’s way more difficult to control influx of people in a connected economy like the EU for example. It’s basically like saying the state of New York could have been able to drive COVID down to zero while other states had it exploding.