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There actually are a few plugin managers for Vim. I think i used Vundle once upon a time, but honestly don't recall. My biggest pet peeve with vim and emacs is

There actually are a few plugin managers for Vim. I think i used Vundle once upon a time, but honestly don't recall. My biggest pet peeve with vim and emacs is that (a) discovery sucks as with most all text mode tools, and (b) emacs in particular is slow and difficult to configure to get some mainstream languages working. Doom was the closest I ever got to being happy with my setup, but the tooltips and autocomplete were still objectively inferior even to vscode (for typescript and react, at least). Lisps are a different story, but not by much. I'm actually fairly happy with using vscode to write common lisp, though I don't do much of it these days.

yw3410 6y ago
What? Discovery in Emacs is amazing; all the API is a keystroke away. Do you mean something else?
- gegtik 6y ago
  *discovery for laymen
  - otabdeveloper4 6y ago
    Emacs tells you to hit "Ctrl-h" when you start it. The documentation for Emacs is about as good as you can get for a software product. (Now let's talk about Excel if you want to discuss discoverability issues.)
    - gegtik 6y ago
      Sorry to come at this late but there's discoverability-by-doing and I think it's clear from general user feedback that emacs doesn't have it. I agree it's very well documented, and I assume your impulse upon reading the previous paragraph is to tell me there's a REPL. it's simply not casually approachable. sorry. ask someone who isn't drowning in koolaid!
vulcan01 6y ago
Note that the GP said > It doesn't come with... plugin management Also, for Vim, `:<tab>` gives you all available commands in the current buffer and `:h command` gives you the vim help page for that command (which is usually at least a few sentences long, and pretty thorough).
- yosamino 6y ago
  > Also, for Vim, `:<tab>` gives you all available commands in the current buffer Don't misunderstand me, I love vim and use it almost exclusively and everyday, but tab-ing in the way you describe yields 2-3 screenfulls of commands that I have to manually (well, with my eyes anyhow) scan to find what I want and it includes gems such as: "spellrare" and "{{{{{{{{" The latter of which I do not know how to open a help page for. To me "discoverable" would mean that I would be able to use this interface to learn more commands, but this is only as discoverable as having to read man-pages. Sure - that is a great way to learn, but it's not discoverable. Now, what would probably get a little closer is if `:<tab>` opened a list if commands in an fzf-style list also listing their descriptions and maybe grouping them by some other way than just alphabet sort order. (If anyone can tell me what is up with those '{' I would greatly appreciate it)

yw3410 6y ago

What? Discovery in Emacs is amazing; all the API is a keystroke away. Do you mean something else?

gegtik 6y ago
*discovery for laymen
- otabdeveloper4 6y ago
  Emacs tells you to hit "Ctrl-h" when you start it. The documentation for Emacs is about as good as you can get for a software product. (Now let's talk about Excel if you want to discuss discoverability issues.)
  - gegtik 6y ago
    Sorry to come at this late but there's discoverability-by-doing and I think it's clear from general user feedback that emacs doesn't have it. I agree it's very well documented, and I assume your impulse upon reading the previous paragraph is to tell me there's a REPL. it's simply not casually approachable. sorry. ask someone who isn't drowning in koolaid!

vulcan01 6y ago

Note that the GP said > It doesn't come with... plugin management Also, for Vim, `:<tab>` gives you all available commands in the current buffer and `:h command` gives you the vim help page for that command (which is usually at least a few sentences long, and pretty thorough).

yosamino 6y ago
> Also, for Vim, `:<tab>` gives you all available commands in the current buffer Don't misunderstand me, I love vim and use it almost exclusively and everyday, but tab-ing in the way you describe yields 2-3 screenfulls of commands that I have to manually (well, with my eyes anyhow) scan to find what I want and it includes gems such as: "spellrare" and "{{{{{{{{" The latter of which I do not know how to open a help page for. To me "discoverable" would mean that I would be able to use this interface to learn more commands, but this is only as discoverable as having to read man-pages. Sure - that is a great way to learn, but it's not discoverable. Now, what would probably get a little closer is if `:<tab>` opened a list if commands in an fzf-style list also listing their descriptions and maybe grouping them by some other way than just alphabet sort order. (If anyone can tell me what is up with those '{' I would greatly appreciate it)