5 ms·

The article writer spends a lot of time blaming 'leadership' however it is up to all of us to act within our own moral framework. > While the best-trained (and

by agd 6y ago

The article writer spends a lot of time blaming 'leadership' however it is up to all of us to act within our own moral framework. > While the best-trained (and highest-paid) UX professionals are put to work optimizing the exploitation and deception of online users UX workers at Amazon are not 'put to work' like some automotons, they have agency and the ability to find highly paid work elsewhere.

simplemen 6y ago
Where are they going to go? Every company is using dark patterns. Maybe there are a few small ethical companies but that is very small number.
- agd 6y ago
  There are plenty of tech companies not using dark patterns (I used to work for one). Granted Amazon employees might not be able to get paid as much elsewhere, but that's the choice you make.
  - simplemen 6y ago
    I have worked for 5 companies in my 15 years career. One of that company was ecommerce consulting firm which dealt with a lot of mom-n-pop ecommerce stores. Let me tell you not a single one of them was willing to give up any dark patterns if that meant losing revenues. Unless you are working on non-revenue generating product like internal dashboard, it is all about get sales anyway possible. I am sure there are ethical companies, I see many of them mentioned here, started by readers of this forum, but what percentage are those. Imo, they are less than 1%.
almostdeadguy 6y ago
The "you can always go work somewhere else" argument will never stop being a cop out. Your employer controls access to your salary, healthcare benefits, and potentially more. Leaving your job is never a completely safe move and there's an abundance of reasons why it's simply not an option to most people, and it doesn't matter what tier of middle class occupation you have for that to be true. Moreso this argument isn't one to be taken seriously because it assumes every collective failure is a failure of millions of individual choices rather than any of the cultural inertia or environmental influences that steer our choices.
- agd 6y ago
  We're talking about UX designers, and in particular UX designers at large tech companies (FAMAG). UX designers at e.g. Amazon, do have huge optionality to go elsewhere and still get paid good salaries. They are not e.g. clothing workers in Bangladesh. > Moreso this argument isn't one to be taken seriously because it assumes every collective failure is a failure of millions of individual choices rather than any of the cultural inertia or environmental influences that steer our choices. That's a strawman - I'm not saying this applies for 'every collective failure'. Systemic factors are important, however we shouldn't absolve individuals at large tech firms of their own responsibility.
specialist 6y ago
Examples?

by agd 6y ago

simplemen 6y ago

Where are they going to go? Every company is using dark patterns. Maybe there are a few small ethical companies but that is very small number.

agd 6y ago
There are plenty of tech companies not using dark patterns (I used to work for one). Granted Amazon employees might not be able to get paid as much elsewhere, but that's the choice you make.
- simplemen 6y ago
  I have worked for 5 companies in my 15 years career. One of that company was ecommerce consulting firm which dealt with a lot of mom-n-pop ecommerce stores. Let me tell you not a single one of them was willing to give up any dark patterns if that meant losing revenues. Unless you are working on non-revenue generating product like internal dashboard, it is all about get sales anyway possible. I am sure there are ethical companies, I see many of them mentioned here, started by readers of this forum, but what percentage are those. Imo, they are less than 1%.

almostdeadguy 6y ago

The "you can always go work somewhere else" argument will never stop being a cop out. Your employer controls access to your salary, healthcare benefits, and potentially more. Leaving your job is never a completely safe move and there's an abundance of reasons why it's simply not an option to most people, and it doesn't matter what tier of middle class occupation you have for that to be true. Moreso this argument isn't one to be taken seriously because it assumes every collective failure is a failure of millions of individual choices rather than any of the cultural inertia or environmental influences that steer our choices.

agd 6y ago
We're talking about UX designers, and in particular UX designers at large tech companies (FAMAG). UX designers at e.g. Amazon, do have huge optionality to go elsewhere and still get paid good salaries. They are not e.g. clothing workers in Bangladesh. > Moreso this argument isn't one to be taken seriously because it assumes every collective failure is a failure of millions of individual choices rather than any of the cultural inertia or environmental influences that steer our choices. That's a strawman - I'm not saying this applies for 'every collective failure'. Systemic factors are important, however we shouldn't absolve individuals at large tech firms of their own responsibility.

specialist 6y ago

Examples?