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I really like Heroku too and I think it does solve the problem particularly well for simple web apps. The world of devops isn't entirely simple web apps. Nor do
by aprdm 6y ago
I really like Heroku too and I think it does solve the problem particularly well for simple web apps. The world of devops isn't entirely simple web apps. Nor does it necessarily run (or can run) in the cloud.
There's an OSS heroku implementation, dokku I think? If it solves the problem well for what you need then you could just embrace it!
The challenge in some of the companies I've been is that the code base is 20~40 years old, there's a mix of languages, patterns, approaches and OSes generating value to the business.
Standardizing that across 100s of developers across 10s of departments isn't an easy task. Refactoring the deployment/code to whatever was the best practice of the last year isn't a good use of time either. People who wrote some of it left, there's no resources, etc.
The world of startups is quite straight forward, the world of enterprise software or companies that have a decent number of developers and have been around for a while, not so much...
- aristofun 6y agoIsnt all this legacy burden solved on container level? Once you got a container - how complicated should it be to just run it?
- derfabianpeter 6y agoIt’s funny that your questions all imply that this should be a „solved“ problem while you can’t even grasp the complexity of reliably serving arbitrary software applications to arbitrary consumers. All that „legacy burden“ isn’t so legacy and for every layer of abstraction that makes all of this look less complicated, many highly skilled people put in a lot of effort.
- aristofun 6y agoSure this thing can't be solved 100%, just as a problem of running consumer software. But still we have good enough desktop apps, that even a kid can setup and run. Nobody yet clarified what's the fundamental difference between those and apps running in the cloud. > many highly skilled people put in a lot of effort Without good "product" guys supervision they tend to get systems only other highly skilled people can comprehend, btw.
- bradknowles 6y agoDoing one thing once is easy. Do it ten times. That’s harder. Do it ten times each for ten people at once. That’s a lot harder. Do it ten times each for ten people each across ten different cities in ten different states in ten different countries. That’s much, much harder. It’s the “Wheat and Chessboard” problem all over again (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wheat_and_chessboard_problem https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wheat_and_chessboard_problem ). The fundamental problem here is one of scale.