6 ms·

Is this not the classic problem with all censorship? Of course the majority (and I) would agree that the language used is not productive, but the question of wh

by 14u2c 6y ago

Is this not the classic problem with all censorship? Of course the majority (and I) would agree that the language used is not productive, but the question of whether something should be allowed, despite its "goodness" (or lack there of), is much more nuanced. I think an argument can be made that the definition of a public forum has changed.

ohyes 6y ago
No, it isn't. OP can host his own server and invite his friends and they can say whatever they want there.... but no one has any obligation to give him a venue. If I have a shitty band and I want to book your venue for a gig, you have every right to say to me "no, your band is too shitty for my venue, I don't want to degrade myself or the public in that way." There's very little nuance here at all, no one is saying he is not allowed to be a terrible person, they're saying they don't want to be associated with him because he's a terrible person.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- enchiridion 6y ago
  Yes it is. It is not governmental censorship, but it is censorship.
- fossuser 6y ago
  You seem to think “retarded” is magnitudes worse than all of the other negative words you used and worth shutting down a community for. I think most people do not think this is true. I think moderation is hard and I’m generally in favor of private companies being able to moderate how they want (with something like Urbit being a good alternative for a user owned network). That said, the word policing around this and wsb in particular (a pretty good natured community really) is pretty off. I think you’re wrong on this one.
  - ohyes 6y ago
    > You seem to think “retarded” is magnitudes worse than all of the other negative words you used and worth shutting down a community for. To be clear, it absolutely is. https://www.specialolympics.org/stories/impact/why-the-r-word-is-the-r-slur https://www.specialolympics.org/stories/impact/why-the-r-wor... I'm genuinely hoping the huge number of sophists trying to defend it are doing so because they genuinely feel kind of bad for having done so and don't want to comprehend the moral implications of having used it casually for years.
    - fire7000 6y ago
      Why do you make a living hijacking peoples intent?
  - atoav 6y ago
    I know people who grew up with disabled relatives and I can assure you that insult is among the worse things you could use. Maybe those who use it don't think of themselves as bad persons, and "thats just the way language evolved", but if you use this word it shows that you never reflected on the other persons position. It tells me, you are either not the brightest bulb in the shed, unempathic or just mean. So yes, depending on the context using retard as an insult is worse than many other things. It might not be to you, but so might have been the n-word a few generations before. Just because a lot of people don't get it, doesn't mean it is okay. Edit: and now that you know that this insult might cut two ways (because you never know who has a disabled relative), you might also deem it less useful.
    - fossuser 6y ago
      This is a topic that won’t make much progress on an Internet forum (too heated, too personal for people). I think there’s a difference between using the word to target someone who is disabled and using it the way it’s used on wsb. I also think there’s an irony in calling me “not the brightest bulb” for thinking this, which is a euphemistic way to say dumb (or even the word in question) in a way that’s more targeted than most of the forbidden word’s use on wsb. I also don’t use “retarded” in writing either, I just don’t see as much issue with it in the wsb context.
- s1artibartfast 6y ago
  Op doesn’t own the server, but neither do you as far as I know. You are free to express your opinion, but don’t pretend to speak for everyone. In my book, people who use offensive language are preferable to those who make snap value judgement about human worth based on it. The latter is far more destructive
  - ohyes 6y ago
    Discord owns the server. They seem to agree with me?

by 14u2c 6y ago

ohyes 6y ago

No, it isn't. OP can host his own server and invite his friends and they can say whatever they want there.... but no one has any obligation to give him a venue. If I have a shitty band and I want to book your venue for a gig, you have every right to say to me "no, your band is too shitty for my venue, I don't want to degrade myself or the public in that way." There's very little nuance here at all, no one is saying he is not allowed to be a terrible person, they're saying they don't want to be associated with him because he's a terrible person.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
enchiridion 6y ago
Yes it is. It is not governmental censorship, but it is censorship.
fossuser 6y ago
You seem to think “retarded” is magnitudes worse than all of the other negative words you used and worth shutting down a community for. I think most people do not think this is true. I think moderation is hard and I’m generally in favor of private companies being able to moderate how they want (with something like Urbit being a good alternative for a user owned network). That said, the word policing around this and wsb in particular (a pretty good natured community really) is pretty off. I think you’re wrong on this one.
- ohyes 6y ago
  > You seem to think “retarded” is magnitudes worse than all of the other negative words you used and worth shutting down a community for. To be clear, it absolutely is. https://www.specialolympics.org/stories/impact/why-the-r-word-is-the-r-slur https://www.specialolympics.org/stories/impact/why-the-r-wor... I'm genuinely hoping the huge number of sophists trying to defend it are doing so because they genuinely feel kind of bad for having done so and don't want to comprehend the moral implications of having used it casually for years.
  - fire7000 6y ago
    Why do you make a living hijacking peoples intent?
- atoav 6y ago
  I know people who grew up with disabled relatives and I can assure you that insult is among the worse things you could use. Maybe those who use it don't think of themselves as bad persons, and "thats just the way language evolved", but if you use this word it shows that you never reflected on the other persons position. It tells me, you are either not the brightest bulb in the shed, unempathic or just mean. So yes, depending on the context using retard as an insult is worse than many other things. It might not be to you, but so might have been the n-word a few generations before. Just because a lot of people don't get it, doesn't mean it is okay. Edit: and now that you know that this insult might cut two ways (because you never know who has a disabled relative), you might also deem it less useful.
  - fossuser 6y ago
    This is a topic that won’t make much progress on an Internet forum (too heated, too personal for people). I think there’s a difference between using the word to target someone who is disabled and using it the way it’s used on wsb. I also think there’s an irony in calling me “not the brightest bulb” for thinking this, which is a euphemistic way to say dumb (or even the word in question) in a way that’s more targeted than most of the forbidden word’s use on wsb. I also don’t use “retarded” in writing either, I just don’t see as much issue with it in the wsb context.
s1artibartfast 6y ago
Op doesn’t own the server, but neither do you as far as I know. You are free to express your opinion, but don’t pretend to speak for everyone. In my book, people who use offensive language are preferable to those who make snap value judgement about human worth based on it. The latter is far more destructive
- ohyes 6y ago
  Discord owns the server. They seem to agree with me?