5 ms·

helps that a 10kloc c program getting riir'd probably won't be a 10kloc rust program, because c doesn't have libraries and rust does. it is literally impossibl

helps that a 10kloc c program getting riir'd probably won't be a 10kloc rust program, because c doesn't have libraries and rust does. it is literally impossible to write "a small codebase focused on its key value-adds without distractions" in a language that doesn't have strings and requires you to build a dictionary from scratch

ddevault 6y ago
>helps that a 10kloc c program getting riir'd probably won't be a 10kloc rust program, because c doesn't have libraries and rust does. What? Rust has so few libraries of significance that it still depends on C for security-critical areas like SSL. >it is literally impossible to write "a small codebase focused on its key value-adds without distractions" in a language that doesn't have strings and requires you to build a dictionary from scratch Strings are misunderstood, I'm not going to get into it here. My dictionaries in C usually clock in at about two dozen lines of code. The complexity doesn't go away because your language does it for you.
- vitno 6y ago
  that's not true these days, rustls is a great TLS lib that has been through at least one serious external security audit. https://cure53.de/pentest-report_rustls.pdf https://cure53.de/pentest-report_rustls.pdf
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - roblabla 6y ago
    For what it's worth, rustls relies on ring which has primitives written in C and ASM because getting constant-time operation guarantees from Rust is Very Hard. Though progress is being made on this area.
- saagarjha 6y ago
  Having written dictionary implementations in C, I would be very interested in seeing your implementation that fits in two dozen lines of code.
  - ddevault 6y ago
    Threw together an example (untested, with obvious errors) to give you an idea of what it could look like: https://paste.sr.ht/~sircmpwn/3122d4a27a8e5312462e2329bf7ed628b8c135bd https://paste.sr.ht/~sircmpwn/3122d4a27a8e5312462e2329bf7ed6... Actually managed to get it to exactly 2 dozen lines of code, not including the header, which isn't bad for an off-the-cuff remark. You'd naturally expand or shrink this with whatever subset of map functions you require, like key/value enumeration, object deletion, resizing, whatever. It depends on your use-case. I don't believe in generic code.
    - saagarjha 6y ago
      Ok, that makes more sense. I was considering a slightly more fully-featured table and including the header (see: https://gist.github.com/saagarjha/00faa1963023206a8ccd9877983b4546 https://gist.github.com/saagarjha/00faa1963023206a8ccd987798...) and I was a couple times larger than your number, so I was trying to figure out what you were doing that I was unable to replicate…

ddevault 6y ago

>helps that a 10kloc c program getting riir'd probably won't be a 10kloc rust program, because c doesn't have libraries and rust does. What? Rust has so few libraries of significance that it still depends on C for security-critical areas like SSL. >it is literally impossible to write "a small codebase focused on its key value-adds without distractions" in a language that doesn't have strings and requires you to build a dictionary from scratch Strings are misunderstood, I'm not going to get into it here. My dictionaries in C usually clock in at about two dozen lines of code. The complexity doesn't go away because your language does it for you.

vitno 6y ago
that's not true these days, rustls is a great TLS lib that has been through at least one serious external security audit. https://cure53.de/pentest-report_rustls.pdf https://cure53.de/pentest-report_rustls.pdf
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- roblabla 6y ago
  For what it's worth, rustls relies on ring which has primitives written in C and ASM because getting constant-time operation guarantees from Rust is Very Hard. Though progress is being made on this area.
saagarjha 6y ago
Having written dictionary implementations in C, I would be very interested in seeing your implementation that fits in two dozen lines of code.
- ddevault 6y ago
  Threw together an example (untested, with obvious errors) to give you an idea of what it could look like: https://paste.sr.ht/~sircmpwn/3122d4a27a8e5312462e2329bf7ed628b8c135bd https://paste.sr.ht/~sircmpwn/3122d4a27a8e5312462e2329bf7ed6... Actually managed to get it to exactly 2 dozen lines of code, not including the header, which isn't bad for an off-the-cuff remark. You'd naturally expand or shrink this with whatever subset of map functions you require, like key/value enumeration, object deletion, resizing, whatever. It depends on your use-case. I don't believe in generic code.
  - saagarjha 6y ago
    Ok, that makes more sense. I was considering a slightly more fully-featured table and including the header (see: https://gist.github.com/saagarjha/00faa1963023206a8ccd9877983b4546 https://gist.github.com/saagarjha/00faa1963023206a8ccd987798...) and I was a couple times larger than your number, so I was trying to figure out what you were doing that I was unable to replicate…