11 ms·
Facebook is bombarding rightwing users with combat gear ads. See for yourself
- leftwinger 6y agoI am a far leftist who runs a 500+ liked antifa page. I also only see the body armor ads.
- JulianMorrison 6y agoSo basically Facebook is like, you and you, fight! Also buy our weapons.
- bobthepanda 6y agoprobably what's more likely is that with a democrat president, gun companies are pouring money into ads to really juice up already high sales. (generally speaking, people rush to buy guns whenever the specter of gun control comes up, because they think that'll be the last chance they get.)
- rootusrootus 6y ago> people rush to buy guns whenever the specter of gun control comes up And it's mostly in their head. The right was fired up for eight long years driving up the price of guns and ammo while Obama was president, meanwhile he never made even a token effort at gun control.
- CompanionCuuube 6y ago> he never made even a token effort at gun control. That's not actually true, there are incidents like the ammo import ban to automatically prohibiting elderly people receiving financial assistance. The fact that the gun control you were expecting didn't happen doesn't mean that none did.
- handedness 6y agoA balance-of-power strategy's effectiveness is not limited to foreign populations.
- nickpinkston 6y agoInteresting - can anyone else confirm this?
- xorx 6y agoPretty much this. I highly suspect this is just a matter of advertising chasing ROI. Firearms, ammunition (if you can even find it), plate carriers, plates, optics, NVGs, holsters - all of it is selling for at least 200% what it was one year ago right now. Everyone running ad campaigns is seeing ROI > 3 and dramatically increasing spend. Once bids rise to the point that ROI is normalized, we'll see less of this.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- tomcam 6y agoWould you mind revealing that page? I am on the opposite end of the political spectrum but I hold great value in people who are honest about what they are and I’m always reevaluating my positions. I’m not trying to put you on the spot. Feel free to ignore this message.
- tmpz22 6y agoWhat exactly is the opposite side of an anti-fascist facebook page?
- exporectomy 6y agoThe "fascist" in anti-fascist doesn't really mean fascist. It's a slur for right-wingers, like how communist is a slur for left-wingers.
- pii 6y ago"no I'm the victim, not the <xyz group of people who identify politically the same way as me are actively oppressing>"
- meowface 6y ago[...] RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded
- pii 6y agoLol yep
- CompanionCuuube 6y agowoosh
- pii 6y ago
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- smt88 6y ago> "A few months into maintaining my Trump online identities, I started feeling that I needed to buy guns. I knew it was irrational and impractical given my lack of training and urban lifestyle. Nonetheless I was convinced I needed them. When I told my girlfriend, her perplexed response made me realize how deeply my mind had been manipulated by my pro-Trump Facebook feeds." Exactly the kind of effect Facebook is selling, though not always firearm-related, of course. The perfect advertising machine is a mind-control machine. It makes you want things you didn't want before with 100% effectiveness. To the extent thay Facebook spends billions a year on building such a machine, we should believe that they have seen some success beyond a traditional advertising channel (such as TV ads).
- slibhb 6y agoFunny, when I read that part my reaction was "this has to be a joke".
- smt88 6y agoYou don't think it's possible that ads make people want things they don't need? Or to put it another way, you believe advertising is not effective at all on anyone?
- slibhb 6y agoI don't believe the author's bizarre story that, while pretending to be a Trump supporter on the internet, he was brainwashed into wanting to buy a gun by nefarious advertisers. People are susceptible to advertising but we aren't that susceptible. I bet the author is very concerned about "internet radicalization". I bet he's so concerned that he began to feel the stirrings of his own radicalization while pretending to support Trump on the internet. The article is a fantasy brought on by what the author expected to feel. All respect, but if you didn't find the part of the article you quoted funny, your bullshit barometer needs to be recalibrated.
- pushECX 6y ago
- phendrenad2 6y agoIt won't matter. The cause and effect are reversed. They're getting ads because many are actively buying weapons and armor, fearing that the government is going to become authoritarian communists or something. At least, that's what I understood from talking to right-wing friends.
- luxuryballs 6y agoYep and if they turn out to be right then I’ll be glad they were staying vigilant on behalf of the rest of us.
- zepto 6y agoThe communists are only trying to save us from the facists!
- seany 6y agoIt's a weird thing since I have to imaging people that might buy that kind of thing already have it, or would be searching for it on other forums ( I have ).
- jmalicki 6y agoCouldn't you say the same for, say washing machines? You: I just bought a washing machine on Amazon Amazon: "Here are some ads for more washing machines, in case you're an enthusiastic collector!"
- Blikkentrekker 6y agoPerhaps the ads cannot discriminate between those that merely looked at washing machines, and those that actually bought one.
- pietrovismara 6y agoOh they often can, trust me. The tech is all there. It's just a matter of joining the dots at this point.
- herbst 6y agoMany shops specifically send sales data to analtics or fb to optimize their ad audience. So more often than not they know
- vladTheInhaler 6y agoEspecially annoying when they call it "people who bought this also bought". I don't think so Amazon. Just call it "related items" please.
- ashtonkem 6y agoGun owners typically buy more than one gun, often much more, but very few people have two washing machines.
- wtf_is_up 6y agoThis is not surprising or really noteworthy, is it? It seems to be some confirmation of FB targeting working as expected.
- jdan 6y agoShouldn't it be "advertisers are targeting rightwing Facebook users with..."? I was under the impression that it was the advertiser who chooses the target audience.
- r00fus 6y agoThe biggest myth out there is that FB is somehow detached from the ads they permit on their website because of "it's the algorithm" or "we're just a platform". It's obviously complete BS.
- skronch 6y agoThe people who build FB's ads platform have their performance judged by metrics like revenue, eCPM, and internal relevance scores. Building capabilities to add arbitrary human-defined rules into those optimization functions only makes their jobs more difficult and is a drag on hitting team targets. I'm curious why you think they're incentivized to do so.
- srg0 6y agoDrug dealers and human traffickers have their performance judged by their superiors, and are under constant pressure from competition. Law enforcement only makes their jobs more difficult and is a drag on hitting team targets. Let's be more sympathetic to the little guys.
- jabroni_salad 6y agoI'm not completely sure this is just political people. Up until recently I only got ads for kickstarter doodads and airtable, but then it suddenly switched to gun stuff. I don't browse any firearm or political communities, haven't bought stuff, don't watch firearm youtube videos, haven't even been window shopping. There were 5 million new gun owners last year. I think the ad networks just view it as a highly probable click since so many people are suddenly showing interest in firearms that weren't before. Especially for people in my demo/geo... I am white and rural.
- bonestamp2 6y agoThere are a lot of variables that go into those ad network decisions. Are you in a red state or a localized area where guns are particularly popular? Are you friends likely to buy guns? Do you buy other crossover product categories that gun owners also tend to purchase (ex. certain survival or camping gear)? Lastly, price per bid and volume... If nobody else is targeting you, or not paying enough to target you, the untargeted ads might make their way to your feed if they're bidding high enough or if facebook is simply trying to fulfill their ad volume.
- stunt 6y agoThey are spending more money on ads because it's a good time to sell more. People are exposed to enough fear, unrest, and conspiracy theories that many of them only need to see a few ads to make an emotional purchase decision.
- opwieurposiu 6y agoWhen I was working in the machine shop business around 2016 another shop owner called our shop asking if we had any work to sub out. I was surprised because his shop was running at max capacity the year before, making gun parts. Apparently when a republican becomes president the gun parts market dries up; when a democrat wins, the market booms. I think the arms retailers are having a boom right now and have plenty of money for ads.
- casefields 6y agoIt makes sense. When the sky is clear I don't need to worry about rain. When it's cloudy I do. Only 1 is a danger therefore people prepare.
- davmar 6y agoYep, here's one for an AR-15 chamber lock that I got a couple weeks ago: https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=364409318216958 https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=364409318216958 I was shocked. What's suburban dad doing getting out of his SUV in a mall parking lot with an AR-15??? Full disclosure: I'm not on the right wing or even remotely close.
- pageandrew 6y agoWhat makes you think the guy in the ad is a "suburban dad"? These companies sell to police, private security companies, military, and yes civilians. That segment of the ad looks like its targeted to more of a private security/police application.
- yao420 6y agoNot a chance. Cops and security don’t generally carry ar-15’s and those that do certainly are using locks. The site also doesn’t mention a single law enforcement client which is something they would be bragging about. Maybe it’s because I’m a Texan but suburban dads are probably the largest gun owning demographic. Ive so many engineers show up to the range with a $4k ar-15 and shoot a couple hundred bucks in ammo. At least before covid shot prices through the roof.
- Ancapistani 6y ago> Cops and security don’t generally carry ar-15’s You’re in for a surprise if you ever look in a patrol car. Every agency I know of, even in a very rural state, has an AR as standard equipment - either in the cabin, or in rare cases, in a trunk lid mount.
- davmar 6y agoGoogled which weapons cops have out of curiousity and the AR-15 isn't in the top 10 according to this list: https://www.criminaljusticedegreehub.com/popular-guns-for-law-enforcement/ https://www.criminaljusticedegreehub.com/popular-guns-for-la...
- temp667 6y agoWhy does facebook do this rather than let third party advertisers advertise? I thought they got most of their money from third party advertisers, not selling their own products. Note - gun sales are very strong in the US. Antifa / BLM / Armed protestors.
- filoleg 6y ago>Why does facebook do this rather than let third party advertisers advertise? I think that's exactly what FB is doing, to be honest. They are simply letting third party advertisers advertise. Historically, dem president in power has always been an indicator of increased spending on guns (because hardcore gun people become afraid that the dems will make guns more difficult to purchase, so they stock up). And increase in gun sales means increased budget (including ad budget) for gun-related businesses. Higher ad budget for gun-related businesses means more ads for gun-related businesses popping up on everyone's feed, as they keep outbidding other ads. Combine that with the fact that a lot more people in your social network graph became more interested in guns for various reasons over the past year (protests on both sides, covid, dem president, etc.), and you have just massively increased the probability of seeing an ad for a gun-related business.
- notacoward 6y ago> They are simply letting third party advertisers advertise. I don't think it's quite that simple. Facebook controls the juxtaposition of ads with content, and with each other. This can reinforce the power of the individual ads, or attenuate it. In this case, it's pretty clearly creating a "caravan" of ads because that's more effective than letting each stand alone. Disclaimer: I used to work at Facebook, but I was in storage. It gave me no particular insight into how the ad system works. This is just based on general knowledge of how human psychology and ML work.
- filoleg 6y ago>Facebook controls the juxtaposition of ads with content, and with each other. This can reinforce the power of the individual ads, or attenuate it. In this case, it's pretty clearly creating a "caravan" of ads because that's more effective than letting each stand alone. Oh, totally agreed on this one. FB fully controls the layout and where ads are displayed. When I said that FB doesn't control things, I meant that they don't control and decide which ads get shown to you, it is all down to what advertisers advertise, and whether you fall under those specific target audiences.
- nafizh 6y agoPeople at HN proclaiming all FAANG companies are equally bad, here’s another feather to the hat. All of them are bad but if u remove the problems at those companies, their core business model can still survive except Facebook. It’s business, at its heart is creating polarization and alternative realities.
- tnt128 6y agoFirst of all, fb ad policy explicitly doesn’t allow selling fire arms. https://m.facebook.com/policies/ads/prohibited_content/weapons https://m.facebook.com/policies/ads/prohibited_content/weapo... If you are selling related stuff(belts, holster, vest, gun case etc), be prepared to have your fb ad account banned often(as the algo will likely (mis)-categorize you into selling weapons). Advertisers in this space generally are very good at 1) cloaking, 2) renting or purchasing ad accounts. both are against fb policy. But in the end, as long as there is a positive ROI, and there is a way to circumventing the system, people will continue to do that. I don’t see how that’s fbs fault.
- dlbucci 6y agoMaybe they could address the whole "there is a way to circumventing the system" thing? I mean, they own the system, so they should probably be responsible for any circumvention.
- exporectomy 6y agoThey're not circumventing the system, they're circumventing the false positives of the gun-detection algorithm. As the parent pointed out, advertising these gun-related things is explicitly allowed by Facebook.
- mulmen 6y agoThe end justifies the means?
- exporectomy 6y agoI guess so. It's not as if there's anything morally wrong with playing the game of hide-and-seek that Facebook created. No laws are being broken and nobody's being harmed.
- willxinc 6y agoIt's a much harder problem then it appears. Similarly to security, it's a cat and mouse game with the people who are trying to game the system, and developing solutions to catch them without too many false positives.
- lapphi 6y agoIt’s bombarding me with body armor ads too. I’ve never searched for or talked about guns, qanon, or election stuff on my fb browser. Not sure this is specific to one political group.
- NoPicklez 6y agoHere in Australia I have noticed on news.com.au news articles I have been seeing "combat menswear" ads all over US or trump related articles. Very strange.
- followthesmell 6y agoI don't have a gun, and I live in a country that doesn't have a problem with guns, and I'm happy about that. Not everyone who buys these accessories will go on to rush the Capitol, despite the article hinting at that implication. Facebook's advertising policies are not a suitable place to enact desires that people have been unable to achieve democratically. For a hot topic like guns, the constraints on where/when they can be advertised should also be decided democratically.
- ashtonkem 6y agoAs a funny confluence, body armor carriers make fantastic weighted vests. Rogue sells both a ESAPI compatible plate carrier and non-ballistic plates for endurance training. If one was so inclined you could either put armor in your rogue carrier (they used to just be 5.11 carriers), or use actual steel armor during training because they’re heavy.
- gwking 6y agoYesterday I googled "how to measure a chainsaw bar" and got targeted by a clothing company running a sale for tactical clothing, including what I can only describe as domestic terror outfits. It was striking to me to type in a single atypical search term and then be immediately cast into a completely different advertising cohort.
- Triv888 6y agoAre you talking about the outfits that the cops wear nowadays?
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]