4 ms·

Is there anyone here who is familiar with Japanese culture? The country's ability to express truly psychologically horrific "stuff" is unmatched by what's seen

Is there anyone here who is familiar with Japanese culture? The country's ability to express truly psychologically horrific "stuff" is unmatched by what's seen here in the U.S. Is it because the movie industry there is more permissive towards such genere? Is there something in the culture that prompt people to be inspired in this direction.

jephson 6y ago
Your questions make me realise I've long held the presumption this is a cultural response to events like Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
- dfxm12 6y ago
  That's probably part of it and Godzilla is a direct response to it, but Japanese horror goes back further than that. If you're interested, it's worth exploring Japanese folklore. Something Wicked from Japan is an interesting collection of ukiyo prints about this: https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/something-wicked-from-japan-ei-nakau/1125409341 https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/something-wicked-from-japan...
  - jephson 6y ago
    It does feel there's something of a line between the older folklore and the urban, technology-infused tales, but overall it is a great connection to make. Takashi Miike's The Great Yokai War is a nice little take on the old and new sensibilities: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Yokai_War https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Yokai_War
buzzert 6y ago
My personal theory: Article IX of their constitution[0]. During WWII, the Japanese were absolutely brutal and persistent. Having your constitution rewritten to forbid a society like that from having a military could lead to some… extremely creative outlets in art. [0]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_9_of_the_Japanese_Constitution https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_9_of_the_Japanese_Co...
- Cthulhu_ 6y ago
  Can you clarify what you're implying here? It's almost like you believe that not having a standing army makes a country's people pursue extreme artistic outlets.
brbrodude 6y ago
I'm also very curious about on how the deep & disturbing topics seep in, I've seen some YouTube explainers commenting on philosophical stuff under some famous anime and I get confused about the "literature aspect" involved. I won't remember now what Youtubes I mean, but if I remember correctly the narrator really seem to meant that there were a lot of intentional references(possibly it was Ghost in the Shell). Is it just something like "rule of cool" in that they just pick whatever seems 'fucked-up-cool' or is it a culture of going for intellectual hard topics? Are japanese writers just hardcore about philosophy and 'deep reality' topics in general?(again I could be talking crap because I don't haven't even played all the games, but geopolical perspectives in Metal Gear Solid also pretty original and based in actual dry research instead of the charicatures we mostly get from western industry). If anyone is familiar plz help :P
dfxm12 6y ago
...is unmatched by what's seen here in the U.S. Is it because the movie industry there is more permissive towards such genere? Can you elaborate on this? On the face of your comment, I think you might just be unaware of a lot of films that have been made in the US. The article mentioned the American David Lynch's Eraserhead as an influence of these works. David Cronenberg is also undoubtedly a huge influence here as well (I know he's Canadian, but he largely works in the American movie industry). It's not like Tetsuo: The Iron Man was a huge financial or mainstream success. Most of these movies were mostly relegated to the grindhouse, and American has more than its share of grindhouse film makers (ala John Waters). Also consider that The Fly was as big a financial success as Akira. Basically, what I'm saying is that I don't think Japanese artists & audiences are very different from their American counterparts in this regard. It is not distinctly Japanese or American to dream up horrific stuff, but rather, it's human to hold up a mirror to an, at times, horrific existence.
- xiaolingxiao 6y ago
  Yeah that is fair. I am admittedly basic in my understanding of movies. From the outside it does feel as if one side is more prolific.
GuB-42 6y ago
Generally, US horror is more "realistic" than Japanese horror. It is common for US horror movies to be "based on a true story", featuring serial killers that could be real life criminals. It is scary because it is not just a story, it is real life, and you are not safe. Japanese stories are more into the supernatural. They don't try to scare you by making things look as real as possible, instead they mess with your mind, trying to make you accept things that obviously fictive as genuinely threatening. This is just a general trend of course, the west also has its fair share of ghost stories too, and Japan has its deranged killers. My guess is that culture, in particular religion has something to do with it. The Japanese have a rich supernatural world to tap into, full of ghosts and spirits. Westerners essentially wiped that off in favor of an almighty god, where evil come from human with corrupted souls rather than from supernatural entities.

jephson 6y ago

Your questions make me realise I've long held the presumption this is a cultural response to events like Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

dfxm12 6y ago
That's probably part of it and Godzilla is a direct response to it, but Japanese horror goes back further than that. If you're interested, it's worth exploring Japanese folklore. Something Wicked from Japan is an interesting collection of ukiyo prints about this: https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/something-wicked-from-japan-ei-nakau/1125409341 https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/something-wicked-from-japan...
- jephson 6y ago
  It does feel there's something of a line between the older folklore and the urban, technology-infused tales, but overall it is a great connection to make. Takashi Miike's The Great Yokai War is a nice little take on the old and new sensibilities: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Yokai_War https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Yokai_War

buzzert 6y ago

My personal theory: Article IX of their constitution[0]. During WWII, the Japanese were absolutely brutal and persistent. Having your constitution rewritten to forbid a society like that from having a military could lead to some… extremely creative outlets in art. [0]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_9_of_the_Japanese_Constitution https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_9_of_the_Japanese_Co...

Cthulhu_ 6y ago
Can you clarify what you're implying here? It's almost like you believe that not having a standing army makes a country's people pursue extreme artistic outlets.

brbrodude 6y ago

I'm also very curious about on how the deep & disturbing topics seep in, I've seen some YouTube explainers commenting on philosophical stuff under some famous anime and I get confused about the "literature aspect" involved. I won't remember now what Youtubes I mean, but if I remember correctly the narrator really seem to meant that there were a lot of intentional references(possibly it was Ghost in the Shell). Is it just something like "rule of cool" in that they just pick whatever seems 'fucked-up-cool' or is it a culture of going for intellectual hard topics? Are japanese writers just hardcore about philosophy and 'deep reality' topics in general?(again I could be talking crap because I don't haven't even played all the games, but geopolical perspectives in Metal Gear Solid also pretty original and based in actual dry research instead of the charicatures we mostly get from western industry). If anyone is familiar plz help :P

dfxm12 6y ago

...is unmatched by what's seen here in the U.S. Is it because the movie industry there is more permissive towards such genere? Can you elaborate on this? On the face of your comment, I think you might just be unaware of a lot of films that have been made in the US. The article mentioned the American David Lynch's Eraserhead as an influence of these works. David Cronenberg is also undoubtedly a huge influence here as well (I know he's Canadian, but he largely works in the American movie industry). It's not like Tetsuo: The Iron Man was a huge financial or mainstream success. Most of these movies were mostly relegated to the grindhouse, and American has more than its share of grindhouse film makers (ala John Waters). Also consider that The Fly was as big a financial success as Akira. Basically, what I'm saying is that I don't think Japanese artists & audiences are very different from their American counterparts in this regard. It is not distinctly Japanese or American to dream up horrific stuff, but rather, it's human to hold up a mirror to an, at times, horrific existence.

xiaolingxiao 6y ago
Yeah that is fair. I am admittedly basic in my understanding of movies. From the outside it does feel as if one side is more prolific.

GuB-42 6y ago

Generally, US horror is more "realistic" than Japanese horror. It is common for US horror movies to be "based on a true story", featuring serial killers that could be real life criminals. It is scary because it is not just a story, it is real life, and you are not safe. Japanese stories are more into the supernatural. They don't try to scare you by making things look as real as possible, instead they mess with your mind, trying to make you accept things that obviously fictive as genuinely threatening. This is just a general trend of course, the west also has its fair share of ghost stories too, and Japan has its deranged killers. My guess is that culture, in particular religion has something to do with it. The Japanese have a rich supernatural world to tap into, full of ghosts and spirits. Westerners essentially wiped that off in favor of an almighty god, where evil come from human with corrupted souls rather than from supernatural entities.