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I need a new car but I am put off by the range and charging infrastructure of EV. I haven’t looked into it properly yet but I’m surprised there’s not much more

by ekzy 6y ago

I need a new car but I am put off by the range and charging infrastructure of EV. I haven’t looked into it properly yet but I’m surprised there’s not much more good hybrid cars on the market, sounds like a great compromise on the paper. What’s the catch?

Avocadoe 6y ago
The upside and downside of hybrid cars boils down to the same thing: Having two energy systems on-board. While often great, it also makes the whole system quite a bit more complex. You need a gas tank and a battery, electric motors and internal combustion engines, and so on. I don't know how hybrid cars compare in terms of purchase price and maintenance costs, but on paper they are a much more complicated system.
Buraksr 6y ago
Mainly more points of failure, and additional weight to my knowledge. The electric motor allows superior city driving due to the nice fact that you have regenerative breaking and much more efficient low speed operation where an ICE would not be able to run at its most efficient RPMs. While the gas engine gives a lot of convivence that you might otherwise lose. The downside is now you have two drivetrains that need to integrate into a very limited space, with limited weight as the whole goal was to make an more efficient car. Its also non-trivial to make a good transmission let alone one that has two inputs, or even an integrated electric motor. Batteries in a hybrid are also pushed much harder in a way. Batteries are often rated over 20hr discharge cycles as you can generally get more power out of a battery by discharging it slowly. Asking 1A from a 100Ahr battery vs 1A from a 1A battery is very different in terms of effective capacity as well as the longevity of the cell. Given that batteries are so heavy and you need two drivetrains you can only add so much battery capacity. The end result is that its easy for the batteries to age faster in a hybrid. A surmountable issue is heat, batteries don't play well outside a range of limited range of temperatures. Too cold and they will have less effective capacity, too hot and they can be damaged or degrade faster. This issue can be overcome, but is just another way there is more complexity than Tesla's 'the floor is a battery approach'. Hybrids are cool, but they are hard to make right is the tldr.
yread 6y ago
We have a Kia Niro HEV (hybrid with a tiny battery for regenerative breaking) and it's great, 4.5l/100km. We also considered the PHEV (plugin hybrid with battery for up to 60km) but it has a bit less storage space (because of the battery), we don't have anywhere to charge it and it's quite a bit more expensive. It can work very well for people who can charge at home with 30km commute (or charging also at work and 60km commute) though and it's still cheaper than pure electric.
bagacrap 6y ago
hybrids don't really offer much more efficiency over ICE, but they do add cost and complexity (more things to break). The good compromise is PHEV (plug in hybrid) since you get the efficiency of grid energy for short trips but retain the reliability and versatility of ICE.

by ekzy 6y ago

Avocadoe 6y ago

The upside and downside of hybrid cars boils down to the same thing: Having two energy systems on-board. While often great, it also makes the whole system quite a bit more complex. You need a gas tank and a battery, electric motors and internal combustion engines, and so on. I don't know how hybrid cars compare in terms of purchase price and maintenance costs, but on paper they are a much more complicated system.

Buraksr 6y ago

Mainly more points of failure, and additional weight to my knowledge. The electric motor allows superior city driving due to the nice fact that you have regenerative breaking and much more efficient low speed operation where an ICE would not be able to run at its most efficient RPMs. While the gas engine gives a lot of convivence that you might otherwise lose. The downside is now you have two drivetrains that need to integrate into a very limited space, with limited weight as the whole goal was to make an more efficient car. Its also non-trivial to make a good transmission let alone one that has two inputs, or even an integrated electric motor. Batteries in a hybrid are also pushed much harder in a way. Batteries are often rated over 20hr discharge cycles as you can generally get more power out of a battery by discharging it slowly. Asking 1A from a 100Ahr battery vs 1A from a 1A battery is very different in terms of effective capacity as well as the longevity of the cell. Given that batteries are so heavy and you need two drivetrains you can only add so much battery capacity. The end result is that its easy for the batteries to age faster in a hybrid. A surmountable issue is heat, batteries don't play well outside a range of limited range of temperatures. Too cold and they will have less effective capacity, too hot and they can be damaged or degrade faster. This issue can be overcome, but is just another way there is more complexity than Tesla's 'the floor is a battery approach'. Hybrids are cool, but they are hard to make right is the tldr.

yread 6y ago

We have a Kia Niro HEV (hybrid with a tiny battery for regenerative breaking) and it's great, 4.5l/100km. We also considered the PHEV (plugin hybrid with battery for up to 60km) but it has a bit less storage space (because of the battery), we don't have anywhere to charge it and it's quite a bit more expensive. It can work very well for people who can charge at home with 30km commute (or charging also at work and 60km commute) though and it's still cheaper than pure electric.

bagacrap 6y ago

hybrids don't really offer much more efficiency over ICE, but they do add cost and complexity (more things to break). The good compromise is PHEV (plug in hybrid) since you get the efficiency of grid energy for short trips but retain the reliability and versatility of ICE.