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Here is a interactive chart showing various nations [1] Israel will be #1 by far. They have apparently paid $65/dose or something like that, far ahead of what

by jariel 6y ago

Here is a interactive chart showing various nations [1] Israel will be #1 by far. They have apparently paid $65/dose or something like that, far ahead of what others have paid, moreover, the dealing looks a little problematic. Obviously, it's worth far, far more than $65 a person, but it may not make too much sense to get into a vicious bidding war as it's unlikely to increase the rate of production and the surpluses would just be going into the hands of Parmacorps. [1] https://ourworldindata.org/covid-vaccinations https://ourworldindata.org/covid-vaccinations

xiphias2 6y ago
Why not? Bidding should be time based to provide better incentives for the companies to spend money on factories.
- jariel 6y ago
  Because the need for massive, acute production capacity for a specific variation of vaccine is short-lived. What's the odds that we're going to have another pandemic in the next 10 years that has nRNA vaccine? There's no need for massive production capacity other than during a global pandemic, and you probably don't know what you need, supply chains etc. until the time of production or thereabouts. So - the money won't go into building out production capacity for something, when we don't know what that something is, it's constituent parts, or what technologies will be utilized.
  - xiphias2 6y ago
    The money printing that has been done because of COVID (that shows the economic damage) is many trillions of dollars, while the whole market cap of Moderna and BioNTech are in tens of billions. The amount we're spending on productionizing vaccines is nothing compared to the damage the virus creates every day. Businesses a failing every day, and when they go bankrupt they won't be able to come back.
    - jariel 6y ago
      Yes, I know, but it doesn't matter. Spending more on vaccines now probably won't help us create more vaccines 'the next time'. Other things, such as government support for spending more on vaccines overall - this might help.
      - xiphias2 6y ago
        I see...the RNA vaccine factory is useful though. Moderna announced already months ago that it is planning to have a flu vaccine next year. And for them changing the RNA sequence is really easy, so they can adapt their vaccine as the flu virus is mutating (just like what they are doing right now with coronavirus).
- jeffshek 6y ago
  You're right that it'll impact long-term incentives, however - short-term vaccines are supply-blocked. A bidding war (probably) would be profit capture for those selling vaccines, but won't actually raise the amount of available (in the short-term). Since most timelines are less than 2 years, the time to build a factory can be around that in the States (or even more).
ahelwer 6y ago
Misleading to say Israel is in the lead when the stats don't count the 4.5 million Palestinians living under their control, none of whom are being vaccinated.

by jariel 6y ago

xiphias2 6y ago

Why not? Bidding should be time based to provide better incentives for the companies to spend money on factories.

jariel 6y ago
Because the need for massive, acute production capacity for a specific variation of vaccine is short-lived. What's the odds that we're going to have another pandemic in the next 10 years that has nRNA vaccine? There's no need for massive production capacity other than during a global pandemic, and you probably don't know what you need, supply chains etc. until the time of production or thereabouts. So - the money won't go into building out production capacity for something, when we don't know what that something is, it's constituent parts, or what technologies will be utilized.
- xiphias2 6y ago
  The money printing that has been done because of COVID (that shows the economic damage) is many trillions of dollars, while the whole market cap of Moderna and BioNTech are in tens of billions. The amount we're spending on productionizing vaccines is nothing compared to the damage the virus creates every day. Businesses a failing every day, and when they go bankrupt they won't be able to come back.
  - jariel 6y ago
    Yes, I know, but it doesn't matter. Spending more on vaccines now probably won't help us create more vaccines 'the next time'. Other things, such as government support for spending more on vaccines overall - this might help.
    - xiphias2 6y ago
      I see...the RNA vaccine factory is useful though. Moderna announced already months ago that it is planning to have a flu vaccine next year. And for them changing the RNA sequence is really easy, so they can adapt their vaccine as the flu virus is mutating (just like what they are doing right now with coronavirus).
jeffshek 6y ago
You're right that it'll impact long-term incentives, however - short-term vaccines are supply-blocked. A bidding war (probably) would be profit capture for those selling vaccines, but won't actually raise the amount of available (in the short-term). Since most timelines are less than 2 years, the time to build a factory can be around that in the States (or even more).

ahelwer 6y ago

Misleading to say Israel is in the lead when the stats don't count the 4.5 million Palestinians living under their control, none of whom are being vaccinated.