4 ms·

> the butcher, and at the fish market, and at the grocery store Those are all just commerce that you commute to, though. As someone who worked in the service i

> the butcher, and at the fish market, and at the grocery store Those are all just commerce that you commute to, though. As someone who worked in the service industry for years, 99% of the people I met at work (the "regulars", the overly chatty parents who haven't seen an adult this month, etc) I would never consider part of my community. How many conversations do you have with members of your community that you're not buying something from?

AmericanChopper 6y ago
Most of them... a majority of them would be other people who go to the same places I go. That said, most relationships in a community of people are going to be at least somewhat superficial, because nobody can maintain deep personal relationships with hundreds of people. The idea that the whole thing is just a cynical commercial racket is silly though. Building a real relationship with your community is the whole point of small local business. A lot of those relationships are genuine friendships. The owner of my local coffee shop invites my wife and I over for dinner every so often, and vice versa. I had my local butcher over a couple of weeks ago because he wanted me to teach him how to make beef rendang. Even if commerce underlies the relationship, it can still be entirely community based.
- codemac 6y ago
  I'm not saying it's a cynical commercial racket, that would be silly. What I am saying is that you should have connections with the other people in your community at the shop, not the person hired to interact with you. The relationship with the store owner has nothing to do with whether you drive a car or not. The relationship you have with others, the other folks at the store shopping, etc are much harder in a suburban geography literally because of the lack of interactions. Drivethu's are the extreme of this. It's my hypothesis that having a relationship with your local butcher or coffee maker has little to nothing to do with your car, but the relationships you have with others merely due to their proximity to you is the beauty of community. Digital or physical.
  - AmericanChopper 6y ago
    > What I am saying is that you should have connections with the other people in your community at the shop I don’t think this is an essential element of community at all, but as I said “ a majority of [the other community members I interact with] would be other people who go to the same places I go” > It's my hypothesis that having a relationship with your local butcher or coffee maker has little to nothing to do with your car I’d say you’re right. But I’d also say that the comment “cities are made for cars not people” is equally as insightful as the comment “footpaths are made for shoes not people”, “cycle lanes are made for bicycles not people” or “rail lines are made for trains not people”. Because at the end of the day, shoes, bicycles, cars, buses, trains... are all made for people. I would suggest that a persons perception of their local community has much more to do with how they interact with it than it does the form of transport they use. I’m also certain that there would be a large number of people who live in the same community as I do, which I find to be particularly vibrant, who spend their time not socializing with anybody, and then go home at the end of the day to take out their phone and complain about lack of community.
    - codemac 6y ago
      > “footpaths are made for shoes not people”, “cycle lanes are made for bicycles not people” or “rail lines are made for trains not people”. Only one of those literally puts a glass and metal wall between every single person, and I think it's a significant difference in how social you can realistically be, as all time spent traveling is no longer occurring within a social context, but a private one.
      - AmericanChopper 6y ago
        Having travelled to many different cities that have many different styles of public transport, I can very confidently say the cities of the world are firmly divided into two camps on this topic. One where you don’t talk to other people on the bus/train because you never know who’s going to turn out to be a violent drug addled lunatic, and another where you don’t talk to people on the bus/train because it’s impolite. There is literally no city in the world where people are interested in the social experience of public transport.
refurb 6y ago
I mean, I worked retail too and I get what you're saying. However, just because you don't have a deep, meaningful relationship with someone doesn't mean they aren't a part of your community. Hell, I've probably chatted with my mailman 3 times in the past 3 years, but we recognize each other and say hi and ask how each other are doing. Just because I wouldn't call him if I needed a kidney doesn't mean he's not a part of my (the) community.

AmericanChopper 6y ago

Most of them... a majority of them would be other people who go to the same places I go. That said, most relationships in a community of people are going to be at least somewhat superficial, because nobody can maintain deep personal relationships with hundreds of people. The idea that the whole thing is just a cynical commercial racket is silly though. Building a real relationship with your community is the whole point of small local business. A lot of those relationships are genuine friendships. The owner of my local coffee shop invites my wife and I over for dinner every so often, and vice versa. I had my local butcher over a couple of weeks ago because he wanted me to teach him how to make beef rendang. Even if commerce underlies the relationship, it can still be entirely community based.

codemac 6y ago
I'm not saying it's a cynical commercial racket, that would be silly. What I am saying is that you should have connections with the other people in your community at the shop, not the person hired to interact with you. The relationship with the store owner has nothing to do with whether you drive a car or not. The relationship you have with others, the other folks at the store shopping, etc are much harder in a suburban geography literally because of the lack of interactions. Drivethu's are the extreme of this. It's my hypothesis that having a relationship with your local butcher or coffee maker has little to nothing to do with your car, but the relationships you have with others merely due to their proximity to you is the beauty of community. Digital or physical.
- AmericanChopper 6y ago
  > What I am saying is that you should have connections with the other people in your community at the shop I don’t think this is an essential element of community at all, but as I said “ a majority of [the other community members I interact with] would be other people who go to the same places I go” > It's my hypothesis that having a relationship with your local butcher or coffee maker has little to nothing to do with your car I’d say you’re right. But I’d also say that the comment “cities are made for cars not people” is equally as insightful as the comment “footpaths are made for shoes not people”, “cycle lanes are made for bicycles not people” or “rail lines are made for trains not people”. Because at the end of the day, shoes, bicycles, cars, buses, trains... are all made for people. I would suggest that a persons perception of their local community has much more to do with how they interact with it than it does the form of transport they use. I’m also certain that there would be a large number of people who live in the same community as I do, which I find to be particularly vibrant, who spend their time not socializing with anybody, and then go home at the end of the day to take out their phone and complain about lack of community.
  - codemac 6y ago
    > “footpaths are made for shoes not people”, “cycle lanes are made for bicycles not people” or “rail lines are made for trains not people”. Only one of those literally puts a glass and metal wall between every single person, and I think it's a significant difference in how social you can realistically be, as all time spent traveling is no longer occurring within a social context, but a private one.
    - AmericanChopper 6y ago
      Having travelled to many different cities that have many different styles of public transport, I can very confidently say the cities of the world are firmly divided into two camps on this topic. One where you don’t talk to other people on the bus/train because you never know who’s going to turn out to be a violent drug addled lunatic, and another where you don’t talk to people on the bus/train because it’s impolite. There is literally no city in the world where people are interested in the social experience of public transport.

refurb 6y ago

I mean, I worked retail too and I get what you're saying. However, just because you don't have a deep, meaningful relationship with someone doesn't mean they aren't a part of your community. Hell, I've probably chatted with my mailman 3 times in the past 3 years, but we recognize each other and say hi and ask how each other are doing. Just because I wouldn't call him if I needed a kidney doesn't mean he's not a part of my (the) community.