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I don’t think professional athletes are a good population sample to map onto the general population. Athletes are highly incentivized to burn bright and flare o

I don’t think professional athletes are a good population sample to map onto the general population. Athletes are highly incentivized to burn bright and flare out. Take NFL players. Yes, an obviously aggressive sport that lends itself to short careers…but even then, the average stint is 3.3 years. (https://www.statista.com/statistics/240102/average-player-career-length-in-the-national-football-league/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/240102/average-player-ca...) You will do anything, no matter how deleterious, to keep yourself in the game, damn the consequences. And by anything, I mean a steady diet of uppers, downers, and steroids.

graeme 6y ago
I replied to another comment to say that olympic athletes actually live longer than average. NFl players aren’t a great example. That much traumatic brain injury is seriously harmful to health. Among olympic athletes, those in contact sports did less well. You do have a point as sumo is grueling and involves contact, but you wouldn’t expect hard playing to take off that much life expectancy all on its own. Sumo wrestlers surely lose some from adiposity. https://theculturetrip.com/europe/united-kingdom/articles/athletes-who-play-these-sports-live-the-longest/ https://theculturetrip.com/europe/united-kingdom/articles/at...
chongli 6y ago
NFL players have another major issue that greatly shortens lifespans: CTE [1]. I wonder how much sumo wrestlers are affected by it. I could imagine it also being a problem due to the powerful impacts from their heavy bodies slamming against each other. [1] https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/chronic-traumatic-encephalopathy/symptoms-causes/syc-20370921 https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/chronic-traum...
jhowell 6y ago
If I recall correctly the same is not true for professional cyclists [1], a sport with a rich doping history. They seem to live longer than the general population. I believe this is related to the impact on the body versus steroids. 1. https://www.cyclingweekly.com/fitness/cyclists-live-longer-asked-google-weve-got-answer-389628 https://www.cyclingweekly.com/fitness/cyclists-live-longer-a...
- AtlasBarfed 6y ago
  Cycling does have a rich history of doping, but it also has a rich history of critical coverage of its doping. Does anyone honestly think that international soccer, which is also a sport where athletes would richly benefit from both EPO and steroids, actually has less doping (at least as covered by the press) than cycling, when there is 10x-100x as much money?
- bagacrap 6y ago
  unfortunately I can't get the full text of the cited study but it sounds like baloney to me based on the numbers. TDF cyclists live to 81 vs 73 for the general population. But to be a tdf cyclist you have to first live to (and be healthy in) your 20s. What is the life expectancy of a normal citizen who is in their 20s and healthy? Surely more than the "general population", which includes infant deaths, people with degenerative conditions, etc.
- thesz 6y ago
  My personal trainer told me that first application of anabolic steroids was in endurance sports like cycling. One effect of testosterone is to increase red blood cells count, enhancing the oxygen transfer and thus endurance. (BTW, red wine's quercetin blocks testosterone's drainage by kidneys and indirectly elevates red blood cells count) The weightlifting also has positive effect on the longevity: https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/04/190412085247.htm https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/04/190412085247.h... To counter your article about cycling: https://www.dw.com/en/michael-goolaerts-death-raises-question-as-to-why-so-many-cyclists-suffer-heart-attacks/a-43321799 https://www.dw.com/en/michael-goolaerts-death-raises-questio... And obligatory reference to Marko Pantani: https://crushingiron.com/cycling-is-the-toughest-sport/ https://crushingiron.com/cycling-is-the-toughest-sport/ He was so fit, he has to cycle several times at night to make his heart go faster and not to die. The article of yours was not about professional cyclists, more about "cycling fitness" approach. I love cycling - it improves deadlift immensely. But professional cycling is different. Very different. And dangerous.
  - xref 6y ago
    > He was so fit, he has to cycle several times at night to make his heart go faster and not to die. That wasn’t because he was “so fit” was it, but rather from being in the middle of a powerful doping regimen (like all top cyclists were, you simply couldn’t compete otherwise) raising your hemocrit level to the point it could kill you? Vid about it: https://youtu.be/hT8GZlBBv5k https://youtu.be/hT8GZlBBv5k
jimbob45 6y ago
Yeah, for anyone who doesn’t know, everyone in the NFL is on HGH. Their tests are inadequate and they didn’t even test for it whatsoever until 2010. Even better, if you know you’re going to be injured, you can just take PEDs and laugh right on through your suspension since you weren’t going to be playing anyway (see: Edelman, Branch, others).
- bagacrap 6y ago
  yeah, but then again it's probably more deleterious to your health to try to survive in the nfl without juicing so can you blame them?

graeme 6y ago

I replied to another comment to say that olympic athletes actually live longer than average. NFl players aren’t a great example. That much traumatic brain injury is seriously harmful to health. Among olympic athletes, those in contact sports did less well. You do have a point as sumo is grueling and involves contact, but you wouldn’t expect hard playing to take off that much life expectancy all on its own. Sumo wrestlers surely lose some from adiposity. https://theculturetrip.com/europe/united-kingdom/articles/athletes-who-play-these-sports-live-the-longest/ https://theculturetrip.com/europe/united-kingdom/articles/at...

chongli 6y ago

NFL players have another major issue that greatly shortens lifespans: CTE [1]. I wonder how much sumo wrestlers are affected by it. I could imagine it also being a problem due to the powerful impacts from their heavy bodies slamming against each other. [1] https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/chronic-traumatic-encephalopathy/symptoms-causes/syc-20370921 https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/chronic-traum...

jhowell 6y ago

If I recall correctly the same is not true for professional cyclists [1], a sport with a rich doping history. They seem to live longer than the general population. I believe this is related to the impact on the body versus steroids. 1. https://www.cyclingweekly.com/fitness/cyclists-live-longer-asked-google-weve-got-answer-389628 https://www.cyclingweekly.com/fitness/cyclists-live-longer-a...

AtlasBarfed 6y ago
Cycling does have a rich history of doping, but it also has a rich history of critical coverage of its doping. Does anyone honestly think that international soccer, which is also a sport where athletes would richly benefit from both EPO and steroids, actually has less doping (at least as covered by the press) than cycling, when there is 10x-100x as much money?
bagacrap 6y ago
unfortunately I can't get the full text of the cited study but it sounds like baloney to me based on the numbers. TDF cyclists live to 81 vs 73 for the general population. But to be a tdf cyclist you have to first live to (and be healthy in) your 20s. What is the life expectancy of a normal citizen who is in their 20s and healthy? Surely more than the "general population", which includes infant deaths, people with degenerative conditions, etc.
thesz 6y ago
My personal trainer told me that first application of anabolic steroids was in endurance sports like cycling. One effect of testosterone is to increase red blood cells count, enhancing the oxygen transfer and thus endurance. (BTW, red wine's quercetin blocks testosterone's drainage by kidneys and indirectly elevates red blood cells count) The weightlifting also has positive effect on the longevity: https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/04/190412085247.htm https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/04/190412085247.h... To counter your article about cycling: https://www.dw.com/en/michael-goolaerts-death-raises-question-as-to-why-so-many-cyclists-suffer-heart-attacks/a-43321799 https://www.dw.com/en/michael-goolaerts-death-raises-questio... And obligatory reference to Marko Pantani: https://crushingiron.com/cycling-is-the-toughest-sport/ https://crushingiron.com/cycling-is-the-toughest-sport/ He was so fit, he has to cycle several times at night to make his heart go faster and not to die. The article of yours was not about professional cyclists, more about "cycling fitness" approach. I love cycling - it improves deadlift immensely. But professional cycling is different. Very different. And dangerous.
- xref 6y ago
  > He was so fit, he has to cycle several times at night to make his heart go faster and not to die. That wasn’t because he was “so fit” was it, but rather from being in the middle of a powerful doping regimen (like all top cyclists were, you simply couldn’t compete otherwise) raising your hemocrit level to the point it could kill you? Vid about it: https://youtu.be/hT8GZlBBv5k https://youtu.be/hT8GZlBBv5k

jimbob45 6y ago

Yeah, for anyone who doesn’t know, everyone in the NFL is on HGH. Their tests are inadequate and they didn’t even test for it whatsoever until 2010. Even better, if you know you’re going to be injured, you can just take PEDs and laugh right on through your suspension since you weren’t going to be playing anyway (see: Edelman, Branch, others).

bagacrap 6y ago
yeah, but then again it's probably more deleterious to your health to try to survive in the nfl without juicing so can you blame them?