4 ms·

I'm not sure this works very well. I tried running the test on T-mobile's LTE which has free Spotify streaming. It basically said there was "no differentiation"

I'm not sure this works very well. I tried running the test on T-mobile's LTE which has free Spotify streaming. It basically said there was "no differentiation" implying there was no packet inspection? EDIT: Re-read the technical details. I think it can only measure one aspect of Net Neutrality I.e. Throttling one in favor of the other. Which seems reasonable. But I don't think it should be marketed as detecting "Net Neutrality Violation".

gcblkjaidfj 6y ago
tmobile still steals DNS requests to their weird search page? that alone would get them very low grades in my book.
- arcticbull 6y ago
  Aways set your DNS, preferably to 1.1.1.1
  - gcblkjaidfj 6y ago
    Google won't allow you on non rooted android phones. > cue in google apologists telling me how to root or install hacks to do that and that it is totally possible
    - Toutouxc 6y ago
      How does it work? Does an Android on my WiFi just ignore the DHCP provided DNS, or..?
      - grahamburger 6y ago
        They're forcing DoH, DNS over HTTPS.
    - isiahl 6y ago
      Just tested with my S9+ and could change my DNS settings
    - alias_neo 6y ago
      On newer Android versions there's a setting called "Private DNS", I usually set it to Cloudflare IPv6 DNS. There is 100% some funky shit going on in Android though; I was working on a project the other night and my phone absolutely refused to connect to the service on my PC. My phone and tablet both on Android simply gave me "no route to host" or timeouts even with data disabled and WiFi only set; this is connecting directly to IPs no hosts/DNS. Of course I assumed the firewall was up until I confirmed every other computing device I can access was able to hit it. Why is my phone messing with my networking on my private network?
    - the_pwner224 6y ago
      You can edit the wifi network and change from DHCP to static IP. Then you can set the DNS for that network right there. You run the risk where your phone is set to always use 192.168.1.147 but another device @ .147 is already connected via DHCP, but it's not really a thing that will happen because the chances are so low. And it's a bit hard on public WiFi where finding the gateway, subnet mask, etc. could be hard, or there might be some access control mechanism on the network side. But for a large amount of people, setting the DNS on their home WiFi with this method would cover 50-90%+ of network usage. No root required. > cue in google apologists telling me how to root or install hacks to do that and that it is totally possible I'm not a google apologist btw. Running lineageos with no gapps. With a root-based workaround to get around Google's stupid/illogical/incorrect geography-based call recording restrictions.
      - inetknght 6y ago
        > You can edit the wifi network and change from DHCP to static IP. Then you can set the DNS for that network right there. Gross. I want to accept an IP address without accepting anything else. Just the IP address. Nothing else. Let me choose to turn off the default gateway on this network or even do something dumb like assign a different default gateway. Let me choose what DNS server to use. Let me opt-in to any other routes the network thinks I need. Let me opt-in to a time server. Give control of my device back!
    - oehpr 6y ago
      Was this an old policy? I'm on an LG G8X that is not rooted but I can set DNS. Does LG just grant the permission to do that?
  - scrps 6y ago
    Even this isn't enough anymore. About one or two years ago I was fooling around with DNS queries out of boredom and I did a simple nslookup on a domain I knew would be NX (it was a .ss address), lo and behold it returned an IP and the responding DNS server was not what I use, tried another domain I knew would be non-existent... Same IP, browsed to it and I got a Spectrum "search" (it literally showed results for related sites I had been browsing) page. The real problem with this is that I never use the ISP supplied DNS servers. I double checked everything to ensure something in the network chain didn't default to the ISP DNS, turned out either Spectrum was either hijacking every DNS query but passing valid replies or running DPI and hijacking certain queries. I reported all this to EFF but never heard back. I switched to DNSCrypt to mitigate.
    - gcblkjaidfj 6y ago
      You can set DNS on newer android because it is meaningless. Now that *no* app uses the OS dns anymore, but the HTTPS one, you can change it at will. Go fiddle with your useless settings :(
pmb 6y ago
It is almost precisely what "network neutrality" means in the EU. The US definition is different.
walrus01 6y ago
> I'm not sure this works very well. I tried running the test on T-mobile's LTE which has free Spotify streaming. It basically said there was "no differentiation" implying there was no packet inspection? t-mobile, for instance, can't MITM TLS1.2 or TLS1.3 connections between the youtube client on your ios or android phone, and google. they have direct peering connections all over the place with the google AS and can manipulate traffic in other ways, as it hits the edge of their network. but they absolutely can recognize traffic on source/origin, or per-flow basis and rate limit it so that you get a 480p stream instead of 1080p (nevermind 4K). https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25880146 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25880146 https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=t-mobile+480p+youtube https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=t-mobile+...

gcblkjaidfj 6y ago

tmobile still steals DNS requests to their weird search page? that alone would get them very low grades in my book.

arcticbull 6y ago
Aways set your DNS, preferably to 1.1.1.1
- gcblkjaidfj 6y ago
  Google won't allow you on non rooted android phones. > cue in google apologists telling me how to root or install hacks to do that and that it is totally possible
  - Toutouxc 6y ago
    How does it work? Does an Android on my WiFi just ignore the DHCP provided DNS, or..?
    - grahamburger 6y ago
      They're forcing DoH, DNS over HTTPS.
  - isiahl 6y ago
    Just tested with my S9+ and could change my DNS settings
  - alias_neo 6y ago
    On newer Android versions there's a setting called "Private DNS", I usually set it to Cloudflare IPv6 DNS. There is 100% some funky shit going on in Android though; I was working on a project the other night and my phone absolutely refused to connect to the service on my PC. My phone and tablet both on Android simply gave me "no route to host" or timeouts even with data disabled and WiFi only set; this is connecting directly to IPs no hosts/DNS. Of course I assumed the firewall was up until I confirmed every other computing device I can access was able to hit it. Why is my phone messing with my networking on my private network?
  - the_pwner224 6y ago
    You can edit the wifi network and change from DHCP to static IP. Then you can set the DNS for that network right there. You run the risk where your phone is set to always use 192.168.1.147 but another device @ .147 is already connected via DHCP, but it's not really a thing that will happen because the chances are so low. And it's a bit hard on public WiFi where finding the gateway, subnet mask, etc. could be hard, or there might be some access control mechanism on the network side. But for a large amount of people, setting the DNS on their home WiFi with this method would cover 50-90%+ of network usage. No root required. > cue in google apologists telling me how to root or install hacks to do that and that it is totally possible I'm not a google apologist btw. Running lineageos with no gapps. With a root-based workaround to get around Google's stupid/illogical/incorrect geography-based call recording restrictions.
    - inetknght 6y ago
      > You can edit the wifi network and change from DHCP to static IP. Then you can set the DNS for that network right there. Gross. I want to accept an IP address without accepting anything else. Just the IP address. Nothing else. Let me choose to turn off the default gateway on this network or even do something dumb like assign a different default gateway. Let me choose what DNS server to use. Let me opt-in to any other routes the network thinks I need. Let me opt-in to a time server. Give control of my device back!
  - oehpr 6y ago
    Was this an old policy? I'm on an LG G8X that is not rooted but I can set DNS. Does LG just grant the permission to do that?
- scrps 6y ago
  Even this isn't enough anymore. About one or two years ago I was fooling around with DNS queries out of boredom and I did a simple nslookup on a domain I knew would be NX (it was a .ss address), lo and behold it returned an IP and the responding DNS server was not what I use, tried another domain I knew would be non-existent... Same IP, browsed to it and I got a Spectrum "search" (it literally showed results for related sites I had been browsing) page. The real problem with this is that I never use the ISP supplied DNS servers. I double checked everything to ensure something in the network chain didn't default to the ISP DNS, turned out either Spectrum was either hijacking every DNS query but passing valid replies or running DPI and hijacking certain queries. I reported all this to EFF but never heard back. I switched to DNSCrypt to mitigate.
  - gcblkjaidfj 6y ago
    You can set DNS on newer android because it is meaningless. Now that *no* app uses the OS dns anymore, but the HTTPS one, you can change it at will. Go fiddle with your useless settings :(

pmb 6y ago

It is almost precisely what "network neutrality" means in the EU. The US definition is different.

walrus01 6y ago

> I'm not sure this works very well. I tried running the test on T-mobile's LTE which has free Spotify streaming. It basically said there was "no differentiation" implying there was no packet inspection? t-mobile, for instance, can't MITM TLS1.2 or TLS1.3 connections between the youtube client on your ios or android phone, and google. they have direct peering connections all over the place with the google AS and can manipulate traffic in other ways, as it hits the edge of their network. but they absolutely can recognize traffic on source/origin, or per-flow basis and rate limit it so that you get a 480p stream instead of 1080p (nevermind 4K). https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25880146 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25880146 https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=t-mobile+480p+youtube https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=t-mobile+...