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Here's a more detailed (German) discussion of what the rewrite entails: https://www.heise.de//news/ownCloud-Infinite-Scale-Go-statt-PHP-Microservices-statt-LAMP

by veddox 6y ago

Here's a more detailed (German) discussion of what the rewrite entails: https://www.heise.de//news/ownCloud-Infinite-Scale-Go-statt-PHP-Microservices-statt-LAMP-5029244.html https://www.heise.de//news/ownCloud-Infinite-Scale-Go-statt-... I wonder what this will mean for the competition with Nextcloud? So far, NC seemed to be more active and slightly better than OC, but this move may change the playing board quite drastically.

uselpa 6y ago
Why would that change the competition? I don't think that at the technical underpinnings have been a problem to rollout one or the other. Honestly curious.
- 8fingerlouie 6y ago
  Other than possibly gaining performance from Go vs PHP, as well as less memory consumption. I have no idea how large scale Next/Own-cloud implementations behave, but i'd assume you just throw more hardware after it. What will change though is the relatively well tested and hardened code that is Owncloud today. Switching to Go doesn't just magically make your webapp secure.
- piaste 6y ago
  I run Nextcloud on a Pi 4 and it's a struggle to get acceptable performance out of it. The ecosystem is nice, but I would absolutely trade a few less plugin for a smoother file management experience. I will definitely be checking out OCIS, assuming I find no reason for concern from a license / privacy / security scale. Golang isn't an automatic guarantee of performance, and "microservices" has me pause in the context of a personal server, but it happens that most of the Golang-based applications I host tend to perform extremely well. This coming from someone who strongly dislikes the "simple is better than correct" design of golang.
  - znpy 6y ago
    The problem is probably the pi4. I run nextcloud 20 on a i5-3470 CPU @ 3.20GHz (2c/4t) and for a small use case it works very well. The storage is a rotational (magnetic) hard drive (2TB, seagate barracuda, with zfs 0.8.something)
    - johnchristopher 6y ago
      FWIW I always had performance problems running nextcloud on cheap VPSes while owncloud behaves more smoothly. Anecdata though.
      - znpy 6y ago
        Maybe I hadn't been sufficiently clear: the hardware I mentioned is physical hardware, running at home. No virtual OS or sharing the physical cpu with other tenants. Cheap vps provider often do overselling on the bet that most customers won't be actually using the cpus in user-space 100% of the time (and that's often true). If your provider isn't doing anything nasty, you should be able to see "stolen time" (often indicated with 'st') in top/htop: that's when your vm wasn't actually scheduled on the real cpu.
        johnchristopher 6y ago
        I am inclined to believe you. I am giving nextcloud another try this weekend on my pi (I just found out about nextcloudpi). edit: Aaaaand nextcloudpi is stuck in an endless loop after first login. What was I expecting. https://help.nextcloud.com/t/docker-install-says-initializing-nextcloudpi-for-the-first-time-forever/72687 https://help.nextcloud.com/t/docker-install-says-initializin... And I am not the only one. I'll try again in a year or two. edit2: doesn't explain why owncloud runs smoother than nextcloud though. They must be doing something right.
        johnchristopher 6y ago
        On a whim I tried the vps docker setup on the pi. Runs much smoother (seems like the db was the bottleneck but). edit: Aaaaaaand now I can't login because I foolishly tried to setup webdav and nextcloud is adding 30 seconds to my login and it never actually cool downs. Why do I even bother.
KingOfCoders 6y ago
I have so many problems with core syncing with my NextCloud here - I wish I had used something else. But I guess "competition" is over who has more features.
- pestaa 6y ago
  What issues have you encountered? I can't imagine using anything else, it works so flawlessly for me on multiple devices across different platforms.
  - KingOfCoders 6y ago
    First, how many people are working on those files? I have more problems with more people. The main problem are multi files that are all written together, e.g. Scrivener, Git, ... - I get sync conflicts which are hard to solve.
    - pestaa 6y ago
      I'm not sure what your use case is, but syncing source code repositories to a shared folder doesn't sound like a great idea to me. Collaboration on individual files is also best solved using online office suites and similar tools. The remaining scenarios indeed benefit from file locking and may need conflict resolution from time to time.
      - KingOfCoders 6y ago
        "Collaboration on individual files is also best solved using online office suites and similar tools." Yes, as I've said, I'd use something else, I've fallen for the "Share and collaborate on documents" marketing slogan of NextCloud on their homepage.
mtgx 6y ago
NC should one-up them and do the rewrite in Rust for 20x the performance.

by veddox 6y ago

uselpa 6y ago

Why would that change the competition? I don't think that at the technical underpinnings have been a problem to rollout one or the other. Honestly curious.

8fingerlouie 6y ago
Other than possibly gaining performance from Go vs PHP, as well as less memory consumption. I have no idea how large scale Next/Own-cloud implementations behave, but i'd assume you just throw more hardware after it. What will change though is the relatively well tested and hardened code that is Owncloud today. Switching to Go doesn't just magically make your webapp secure.
piaste 6y ago
I run Nextcloud on a Pi 4 and it's a struggle to get acceptable performance out of it. The ecosystem is nice, but I would absolutely trade a few less plugin for a smoother file management experience. I will definitely be checking out OCIS, assuming I find no reason for concern from a license / privacy / security scale. Golang isn't an automatic guarantee of performance, and "microservices" has me pause in the context of a personal server, but it happens that most of the Golang-based applications I host tend to perform extremely well. This coming from someone who strongly dislikes the "simple is better than correct" design of golang.
- znpy 6y ago
  The problem is probably the pi4. I run nextcloud 20 on a i5-3470 CPU @ 3.20GHz (2c/4t) and for a small use case it works very well. The storage is a rotational (magnetic) hard drive (2TB, seagate barracuda, with zfs 0.8.something)
  - johnchristopher 6y ago
    FWIW I always had performance problems running nextcloud on cheap VPSes while owncloud behaves more smoothly. Anecdata though.
    - znpy 6y ago
      Maybe I hadn't been sufficiently clear: the hardware I mentioned is physical hardware, running at home. No virtual OS or sharing the physical cpu with other tenants. Cheap vps provider often do overselling on the bet that most customers won't be actually using the cpus in user-space 100% of the time (and that's often true). If your provider isn't doing anything nasty, you should be able to see "stolen time" (often indicated with 'st') in top/htop: that's when your vm wasn't actually scheduled on the real cpu.
      - johnchristopher 6y ago
        I am inclined to believe you. I am giving nextcloud another try this weekend on my pi (I just found out about nextcloudpi). edit: Aaaaand nextcloudpi is stuck in an endless loop after first login. What was I expecting. https://help.nextcloud.com/t/docker-install-says-initializing-nextcloudpi-for-the-first-time-forever/72687 https://help.nextcloud.com/t/docker-install-says-initializin... And I am not the only one. I'll try again in a year or two. edit2: doesn't explain why owncloud runs smoother than nextcloud though. They must be doing something right.
        johnchristopher 6y ago
        On a whim I tried the vps docker setup on the pi. Runs much smoother (seems like the db was the bottleneck but). edit: Aaaaaaand now I can't login because I foolishly tried to setup webdav and nextcloud is adding 30 seconds to my login and it never actually cool downs. Why do I even bother.

KingOfCoders 6y ago

I have so many problems with core syncing with my NextCloud here - I wish I had used something else. But I guess "competition" is over who has more features.

pestaa 6y ago
What issues have you encountered? I can't imagine using anything else, it works so flawlessly for me on multiple devices across different platforms.
- KingOfCoders 6y ago
  First, how many people are working on those files? I have more problems with more people. The main problem are multi files that are all written together, e.g. Scrivener, Git, ... - I get sync conflicts which are hard to solve.
  - pestaa 6y ago
    I'm not sure what your use case is, but syncing source code repositories to a shared folder doesn't sound like a great idea to me. Collaboration on individual files is also best solved using online office suites and similar tools. The remaining scenarios indeed benefit from file locking and may need conflict resolution from time to time.
    - KingOfCoders 6y ago
      "Collaboration on individual files is also best solved using online office suites and similar tools." Yes, as I've said, I'd use something else, I've fallen for the "Share and collaborate on documents" marketing slogan of NextCloud on their homepage.

mtgx 6y ago

NC should one-up them and do the rewrite in Rust for 20x the performance.