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I believe that's the case all over Europe. That the US apparently or supposedly allows taking a car driver's license exam in your private car is.. extremely sur

by Tor3 6y ago

I believe that's the case all over Europe. That the US apparently or supposedly allows taking a car driver's license exam in your private car is.. extremely surprising.

gambiting 6y ago
It's not in UK(I realize it's not part of the EU any more, but even when it was it was the same). You take the exam in your own car or a car provided by the training school. The exam centres don't have cars.
- nix23 6y ago
  >your own car or a car provided by the training school. The exam centres don't have cars. Same in Switzerland.
ryanmercer 6y ago
>That the US apparently or supposedly allows taking a car driver's license exam in your private car is.. extremely surprising. At last here in Indiana, you have to provide your own car to take the driving test in.
Ancapistani 6y ago
US drivers’ licensing is much less rigorous than Europe’s as I understand it. In Arkansas, where I live, I got a “learner’s permit” at 14 having passed a short written test. I got my full license at 16 after passing the road test, which consisted of driving for perhaps ten minutes with a cop in the passenger’s seat. I had to drive around the parking lot, navigate and park between traffic cones, then drive the testing route. The testing route started in an industrial part of town with very little traffic and consisted of driving about a mile to a residential neighborhood, circling the block, and coming back to the testing center. I remember being surprised that I didn’t have to demonstrate parallel parking or even driving on a highway. I think I “studied” for the written test by skimming the handout brochure at school during lunch, and had no issues. The driving test was a joke; I’m very confident my 7-year-old could pass it today based only on her having driven utility vehicles (e.g., a Kubota RTV) around our family’s property and having watched us drive from the back seat. Apparently Arkansas revised the licensing system in 2009, and now there is an “Intermediate” license for people under 18. That license is restricted from driving from 11pm to 4am (with exceptions), prohibited from using a cell phone while driving (with exceptions), and all passengers must be wearing a seat belt. If you’re married, in the military, have graduated high school (or equivalent) or have been legally emancipated you can get your full license at the age of 16 years and six months. This discussion had me curious about how the very different licensing regimes might impact outcomes, so I looked up some statistics on motor vehicle fatalities. US (2018): * 12.4 per 100k residents * 14.2 per 100k vehicles Europe (2016) * 9.3 per 100k residents * 19 per 100k vehicles Poland (2019) * 7.7 per 100k residents * 13.5 per 100k vehicles Honestly, I don’t think there’s a substantial impact. The US has 838 vehicles per 1k residents compared to Poland’s 719. I strongly suspect that US drivers drive substantially more miles per year on average, which would more than account for the per capita numbers. Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-r...
- VLM 6y ago
  WRT fatalities its not apples to apples comparison as USA highways are incredibly expensive with concrete barriers between oncoming traffic and in Ireland the highways between cities are literally two lanes no barriers much like USA farm roads yet with interstate highway levels of traffic. Meanwhile the cars involved in the accidents are often unimaginably small and lightweight in EU. Rolling a typical Irish car off the road must have an outcome much like rolling a golf cart would, certainly fatal to the occupants, whereas rolling a typical USA SUV into the ditch will ruin the trim and probably the glass but the occupants should be unharmed if they're wearing seatbelts.
  - throwaway0a5e 6y ago
    I don't think you realize how Americans drive on undivided highways and rural roads nor how strong the cabins of all highway capable vehicles for sale in the US and Europe are.
  - KptMarchewa 6y ago
    1) You're comparing 6 million people country with 300 million people country. 2) I've looked M4 and M7 in Ireland on Google Maps and they have two lanes each side with separation. 3) There is plenty highways in Europe with concrete barriers and few lanes each way.
    - spacemanmatt 6y ago
      > 1) ...300 million people The urban density matters more than the country's population
VLM 6y ago
In my state they roll a lot of safety inspection type stuff into the test. There are no standards for "how to engage the hazard blinkers" across manufacturers so the testing process verifies that at least one time in their driving experience all drivers turned the hazard blinkers on in their private car, and maybe they helped their kids or grandkids figure it out later in life. I've driven several manual transmission cars and its always so awkward for the first couple minutes as there is no standard "feel". EU test inspectors must provide enormous amounts of leeway during testing. Every time I've driven a new manual car the very first time I let the clutch out is always at least somewhat unexpected. So the USA testers get to use smoothness as a proxy for experience. If you let the clutch out like a guy who's never done it before, you are probably lying about the many hours of required yet otherwise unverifiable pre-testing driving experience. So in summary it enforces safety education and proves some level of experience.
- MayeulC 6y ago
  > I've driven several manual transmission cars and its always so awkward for the first couple minutes as there is no standard "feel". EU test inspectors must provide enormous amounts of leeway during testing. Every time I've driven a new manual car the very first time I let the clutch out is always at least somewhat unexpected. That's true, but in my experience (France), the car being driven during the exam is one of your driving school's cars, which you are probably familiar with, since a number of driving lessons are mandated before the exam. Plus, all these cars feature dual controls as a safety measure, not only for pedals, but for blinkers, honk, etc. If the inspector touches their break pedal, you automatically fail the exam.
- KptMarchewa 6y ago
  >EU test inspectors must provide enormous amounts of leeway during testing. In my experience, no. The difference is that pass rates are at 20-30%.
  - gambiting 6y ago
    Exactly. In Poland I did my training in diesel toyta yaris, but the testing centre only had petrol ones. Meaning I obviously stalled the car as soon as I started moving and got the first strike for stalling the car. I had to be super duper careful since I wasn't familiar with the clutch and general feel of a petrol car vs a diesel.
throwaway0a5e 6y ago
Why is that surprising. Presumably it's representative of the kind of car you'll be driving.
- Tor3 6y ago
  The training school car (which is the one I took my exam in) has a double set of pedals and additional mirrors so that the examiner can take over in case you do a horrible mistake. Which does happen quite a lot - some 20-30% of students fail the driving exam, and sometimes for nearly causing an accident (the examiner intervenes).
alasdair_ 6y ago
I took my test in the UK (which was part of the EU at the time) and I used my own car.
CorrectHorseBat 6y ago
Not the case in Belgium. The test center has no cars, you take the exam in your own car or the car of the driving school. What would be the issue? It's the same car you practiced in.

by Tor3 6y ago

I believe that's the case all over Europe. That the US apparently or supposedly allows taking a car driver's license exam in your private car is.. extremely surprising.

gambiting 6y ago

It's not in UK(I realize it's not part of the EU any more, but even when it was it was the same). You take the exam in your own car or a car provided by the training school. The exam centres don't have cars.

nix23 6y ago
>your own car or a car provided by the training school. The exam centres don't have cars. Same in Switzerland.

ryanmercer 6y ago

>That the US apparently or supposedly allows taking a car driver's license exam in your private car is.. extremely surprising. At last here in Indiana, you have to provide your own car to take the driving test in.

Ancapistani 6y ago

US drivers’ licensing is much less rigorous than Europe’s as I understand it. In Arkansas, where I live, I got a “learner’s permit” at 14 having passed a short written test. I got my full license at 16 after passing the road test, which consisted of driving for perhaps ten minutes with a cop in the passenger’s seat. I had to drive around the parking lot, navigate and park between traffic cones, then drive the testing route. The testing route started in an industrial part of town with very little traffic and consisted of driving about a mile to a residential neighborhood, circling the block, and coming back to the testing center. I remember being surprised that I didn’t have to demonstrate parallel parking or even driving on a highway. I think I “studied” for the written test by skimming the handout brochure at school during lunch, and had no issues. The driving test was a joke; I’m very confident my 7-year-old could pass it today based only on her having driven utility vehicles (e.g., a Kubota RTV) around our family’s property and having watched us drive from the back seat. Apparently Arkansas revised the licensing system in 2009, and now there is an “Intermediate” license for people under 18. That license is restricted from driving from 11pm to 4am (with exceptions), prohibited from using a cell phone while driving (with exceptions), and all passengers must be wearing a seat belt. If you’re married, in the military, have graduated high school (or equivalent) or have been legally emancipated you can get your full license at the age of 16 years and six months. This discussion had me curious about how the very different licensing regimes might impact outcomes, so I looked up some statistics on motor vehicle fatalities. US (2018): * 12.4 per 100k residents * 14.2 per 100k vehicles Europe (2016) * 9.3 per 100k residents * 19 per 100k vehicles Poland (2019) * 7.7 per 100k residents * 13.5 per 100k vehicles Honestly, I don’t think there’s a substantial impact. The US has 838 vehicles per 1k residents compared to Poland’s 719. I strongly suspect that US drivers drive substantially more miles per year on average, which would more than account for the per capita numbers. Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-r...

VLM 6y ago
WRT fatalities its not apples to apples comparison as USA highways are incredibly expensive with concrete barriers between oncoming traffic and in Ireland the highways between cities are literally two lanes no barriers much like USA farm roads yet with interstate highway levels of traffic. Meanwhile the cars involved in the accidents are often unimaginably small and lightweight in EU. Rolling a typical Irish car off the road must have an outcome much like rolling a golf cart would, certainly fatal to the occupants, whereas rolling a typical USA SUV into the ditch will ruin the trim and probably the glass but the occupants should be unharmed if they're wearing seatbelts.
- throwaway0a5e 6y ago
  I don't think you realize how Americans drive on undivided highways and rural roads nor how strong the cabins of all highway capable vehicles for sale in the US and Europe are.
- KptMarchewa 6y ago
  1) You're comparing 6 million people country with 300 million people country. 2) I've looked M4 and M7 in Ireland on Google Maps and they have two lanes each side with separation. 3) There is plenty highways in Europe with concrete barriers and few lanes each way.
  - spacemanmatt 6y ago
    > 1) ...300 million people The urban density matters more than the country's population

VLM 6y ago

In my state they roll a lot of safety inspection type stuff into the test. There are no standards for "how to engage the hazard blinkers" across manufacturers so the testing process verifies that at least one time in their driving experience all drivers turned the hazard blinkers on in their private car, and maybe they helped their kids or grandkids figure it out later in life. I've driven several manual transmission cars and its always so awkward for the first couple minutes as there is no standard "feel". EU test inspectors must provide enormous amounts of leeway during testing. Every time I've driven a new manual car the very first time I let the clutch out is always at least somewhat unexpected. So the USA testers get to use smoothness as a proxy for experience. If you let the clutch out like a guy who's never done it before, you are probably lying about the many hours of required yet otherwise unverifiable pre-testing driving experience. So in summary it enforces safety education and proves some level of experience.

MayeulC 6y ago
> I've driven several manual transmission cars and its always so awkward for the first couple minutes as there is no standard "feel". EU test inspectors must provide enormous amounts of leeway during testing. Every time I've driven a new manual car the very first time I let the clutch out is always at least somewhat unexpected. That's true, but in my experience (France), the car being driven during the exam is one of your driving school's cars, which you are probably familiar with, since a number of driving lessons are mandated before the exam. Plus, all these cars feature dual controls as a safety measure, not only for pedals, but for blinkers, honk, etc. If the inspector touches their break pedal, you automatically fail the exam.
KptMarchewa 6y ago
>EU test inspectors must provide enormous amounts of leeway during testing. In my experience, no. The difference is that pass rates are at 20-30%.
- gambiting 6y ago
  Exactly. In Poland I did my training in diesel toyta yaris, but the testing centre only had petrol ones. Meaning I obviously stalled the car as soon as I started moving and got the first strike for stalling the car. I had to be super duper careful since I wasn't familiar with the clutch and general feel of a petrol car vs a diesel.

throwaway0a5e 6y ago

Why is that surprising. Presumably it's representative of the kind of car you'll be driving.

Tor3 6y ago
The training school car (which is the one I took my exam in) has a double set of pedals and additional mirrors so that the examiner can take over in case you do a horrible mistake. Which does happen quite a lot - some 20-30% of students fail the driving exam, and sometimes for nearly causing an accident (the examiner intervenes).

alasdair_ 6y ago

I took my test in the UK (which was part of the EU at the time) and I used my own car.

CorrectHorseBat 6y ago

Not the case in Belgium. The test center has no cars, you take the exam in your own car or the car of the driving school. What would be the issue? It's the same car you practiced in.