7 ms·

Google suspends second AI ethics researcher: union

17 points by elsewhen 6y ago

rjeli 6y ago
Better headline: Google claims employee tried to leak internal documents edit: misread, thought it said thousands of documents, fixed
- tpmx 6y ago
  Sounds interesting - link?
  - rjeli 6y ago
    In TFA. Misread the # of docs, edited
    - tpmx 6y ago
      Okay. So this bit, then: > In a statement to Axios, Google said Mitchell's email account had been locked pending an internal probe into her downloading of a large number of files and sharing them with people outside the company. Edit: I'm guessing the string "levandowski" was used at least once in the code responsible for detecting this.
whitymcwhite 6y ago
Their job was not to make AI more ethical, but to protect Google from government regulation. Seems they fundamentally misunderstood that.
jjcon 6y ago
I’m no fan of google but if their ethicists are found doing unethical things they shouldn’t be immune to suspension just because they have the word ethics in their job title - they should be held to a higher standard not lower
- zepto 6y ago
  That depends on the context. If Google is suppressing the content of the leaked documents in order to hide unethical behavior, then there is a double bind.
- bb88 6y ago
  Ethics is not the same as corporate policy. Ethics needs openness to explore the, well, "ethics" of a particular conflict -- and it can only work on known facts, not speculation. Further, some would say that to be ethical might mean exposing unethical behavior regardless if it violates corporate policy.
vmception 6y ago
Seems to me like the 2-year stints are a big deterrent to joining a union. All you have to do is ignore social causes for 18 months, after an additional 6 months being team selection and other unproductive stuff, and you have an okay probability of clearing $1,000,000 during a bull market? What would have to change for employees to be able to meaningfully change Google? The incentives just are not there. I have heard and read about a concept in Germany where a labor union is part of the board in large companies. That seems like a possible solution in America that nobody seems inspired enough to consider.
- itsdrewmiller 6y ago
  Sen. Elizabeth Warren has proposed legislation to that effect: https://www.vox.com/2018/8/15/17683022/elizabeth-warren-accountable-capitalism-corporations https://www.vox.com/2018/8/15/17683022/elizabeth-warren-acco...
  - vmception 6y ago
    Interesting! Thank you, think this will be reintroduced?
    - hnlurker 6y ago
      Right after we get a prepubescent transgender kid to approve the incoming secretary of education.. https://www.insidehighered.com/quicktakes/2020/02/04/warrens-comments-choosing-next-secretary-cause-stir https://www.insidehighered.com/quicktakes/2020/02/04/warrens...
curtisblaine 6y ago
"it's a private company"

17 points by elsewhen 6y ago

Better headline: Google claims employee tried to leak internal documents edit: misread, thought it said thousands of documents, fixed

tpmx 6y ago
Sounds interesting - link?
- rjeli 6y ago
  In TFA. Misread the # of docs, edited
  - tpmx 6y ago
    Okay. So this bit, then: > In a statement to Axios, Google said Mitchell's email account had been locked pending an internal probe into her downloading of a large number of files and sharing them with people outside the company. Edit: I'm guessing the string "levandowski" was used at least once in the code responsible for detecting this.

whitymcwhite 6y ago

Their job was not to make AI more ethical, but to protect Google from government regulation. Seems they fundamentally misunderstood that.

jjcon 6y ago

I’m no fan of google but if their ethicists are found doing unethical things they shouldn’t be immune to suspension just because they have the word ethics in their job title - they should be held to a higher standard not lower

zepto 6y ago
That depends on the context. If Google is suppressing the content of the leaked documents in order to hide unethical behavior, then there is a double bind.
bb88 6y ago
Ethics is not the same as corporate policy. Ethics needs openness to explore the, well, "ethics" of a particular conflict -- and it can only work on known facts, not speculation. Further, some would say that to be ethical might mean exposing unethical behavior regardless if it violates corporate policy.

vmception 6y ago

Seems to me like the 2-year stints are a big deterrent to joining a union. All you have to do is ignore social causes for 18 months, after an additional 6 months being team selection and other unproductive stuff, and you have an okay probability of clearing $1,000,000 during a bull market? What would have to change for employees to be able to meaningfully change Google? The incentives just are not there. I have heard and read about a concept in Germany where a labor union is part of the board in large companies. That seems like a possible solution in America that nobody seems inspired enough to consider.

itsdrewmiller 6y ago
Sen. Elizabeth Warren has proposed legislation to that effect: https://www.vox.com/2018/8/15/17683022/elizabeth-warren-accountable-capitalism-corporations https://www.vox.com/2018/8/15/17683022/elizabeth-warren-acco...
- vmception 6y ago
  Interesting! Thank you, think this will be reintroduced?
  - hnlurker 6y ago
    Right after we get a prepubescent transgender kid to approve the incoming secretary of education.. https://www.insidehighered.com/quicktakes/2020/02/04/warrens-comments-choosing-next-secretary-cause-stir https://www.insidehighered.com/quicktakes/2020/02/04/warrens...

curtisblaine 6y ago

"it's a private company"