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Maybe this is a weird question, but why do people give drugs to their cats? Is it to see them have fun? Is it so the owners have fun? Is it good for them? I n

Maybe this is a weird question, but why do people give drugs to their cats? Is it to see them have fun? Is it so the owners have fun? Is it good for them? I never quite understood why catnip was so socially acceptable when we view other drugs with such different eyes.

chmaynard 6y ago
A thought-provoking question, thanks for asking.
lreeves 6y ago
For the same reason I smoke weed. They clearly love it and it has no adverse effects (just don't let them eat it, use it in toys).
- the-dude 6y ago
  > has no adverse effects I used to think that too. And I still smoke ( hash, which is different ). However, it does make me complacent, which sometimes make me endure situations I would otherwise change.
  - lreeves 6y ago
    Oh I meant catnip, haha. I think pot definitely has some mild side-effects for sure.
  - _underfl0w_ 6y ago
    Complacency is a huge downside. I'm also much less motivated to work on side projects. Not to mention the toll on the lungs. Ask Willie Nelson if you'd like anecdata about how that can play out over a lifetime. I've recently made the leap to edibles exclusively after a stint with a hot-air vaporizer (a la Volcano devices) and I now find the resin smell of smoking incredibly off-putting. The coughing, hacking, and lung stiffness that results from a bong rip even more so. Doesn't lessen the complacency, but the delay your metabolism introduces can help you get started on projects before it sets in!
aaron_m04 6y ago
> Is it to see them have fun? Is it so the owners have fun? Yes
- waheoo 6y ago
  How dare you?! Won't someone think of the kitty cats?
dylan604 6y ago
Not all humans view drugs in the same manner. In some locales, it is accepted to use drugs recreationally. Other places deem that same usage unacceptable. If you look at the similarity in the gov'ts that deem that usage as unacceptable, there's a common overall belief that is not scientifically based.
- dalbasal 6y ago
  Some sort of drug is usually acceptable culturally. Alcohol, very widely. Cannabis, more recently. Mild drugs like coffee. "Prescribed recreationals" like xanax in some circles. In many places Hashish or opium are still seen as traditional/acceptable. I grew up in Israel, where qat is legal, seen as equivalent to coffee and culturally acceptable. It's fairly common as an ornamental plant. Giving your cat whiskey would cause an uproar, but I guess catnip gets a grandfather exception.
  - pushrax 6y ago
    As far as anyone knows, catnip is completely nontoxic to cats, but ethanol certainly is toxic. Cats also simply don't like the smell of alcohol. Eating very large quantities of catnip can give them gastrointestinal discomfort though.
    - dalbasal 6y ago
      Sure, I wasn't recommending it. I'm just pointing out that it's culturally acceptable to give cats catnip. Culture happens, and sometimes it's rational. Sometimes it's not.
TulliusCicero 6y ago
The impact of recreational drugs is often seen as destructive, in terms of basic physical health, or behavior (e.g. addiction). If catnip isn't destroying cats' lives, what's the harm?
elliekelly 6y ago
Along the same lines, does it gives cats a “hangover” of sorts afterwards? The article describes catnip as similar to heroin for humans. I’ve never done heroin but I would imagine the withdrawal is really unpleasant which is what then causes addiction. Do cats experience the same come down? Can cats get addicted to catnip if they have access to an unlimited supply?
- echoradio 6y ago
  The behavior I notice with my cats when they have some ‘nip is they get a little active then have a time where they just mellow out. But cats also sleep about 16 hours a day, so it is hard to determine at what point being mellow shifts into their typical nap time. I don’t think there’s a long-term tolerance that builds up. I get the sense it is short-acting. I’ve read once a cat has catnip, giving them more in a 15-20 minute window is pointless because they’ve already been “activated” by it. They need to come down from the initial dose first. My cats’ vet has suggested to use catnip to encourage activity (they’re a big chunky and need some exercise).
- dokem 6y ago
  I bought a ton of catnip and my cat seemed to become indifferent to it pretty quickly. Maybe it just dried out, though.
derefr 6y ago
In general: if an animal is observed to purposefully do something in the wild, and that thing isn’t known to be harmful to the animal, then most people will consider that thing to be a valid “enrichment” activity — i.e. something that would be good to offer as an activity for animals of that species, in captivity, to engage in when they seem bored/understimulated. I don’t know about cats with catnip specifically, but many wild animals are observed to purposefully seek out and consume rotten (i.e. fermented, alcoholic) fruit to get drunk/high. (We know that alcohol is harmful to animals, so we don’t tend to offer e.g. captive apes rotten fruit; but we also don’t really stop them from hoarding fruit to make it become rotten, and then eating it. It’s a natural thing that they do. Cats gonna scratch each-other up play-fighting. Apes gonna drink.) But why do we have such a different mindset toward this? I think one big difference is that the human social norms on the acceptable recreational activities for humans are mostly defined/circumscribed by what doctors think is okay (i.e. we take the lead of the medical establishment — if doctors are chill about something, there isn’t usually a social norm against it, while if doctors get upset, other people also get upset.) And doctors don’t like recreational drugs very much, because they usually think in a “harm reduction” mindset rather than a QALY mindset: they’d rather decrease “risk of a loss of capability to experience a satisfying life”, than increase “the area-under-the-curve of satisfying-life-years.” Meanwhile, the human social norms on the acceptable recreational activities for animals are mostly defined/circumscribed by what zoologists think is okay. Zoologists are the people with voices and platforms to talk about animals, since engaging in animal conservation and study tends to directly correlate with seeking funding for that conservation and study, which is usually implemented through educational outreach activities (i.e. building zoos/aquariums/nature parks, giving tours in conservation areas, etc.) And zoologists, traditionally(?), mostly care about what they observe happening in nature. The whole field of zoology is built on observing animals in nature to figure out “what they do.” So our norms on animal recreation lean much more toward “natural ⇒ good” (regardless of harm potential) than “potentially harmful ⇒ bad” (regardless of naturalness.) If veterinarians had the voices and platforms instead, I assume you’d see much more of a harm-reduction mindset in our social norms toward animal recreation.
nkrisc 6y ago
I think most people realize the futility of trying to apply human morality to non-human animals.
echoradio 6y ago
Your post reminded me of this humorous drug education film parody: https://vimeo.com/44733000 https://vimeo.com/44733000
- shaftway 6y ago
  I clicked on that fully expecting it to be the demonstration of various drugs on spiders: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2HipedgM3I https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2HipedgM3I
INTPenis 6y ago
You raise a really good point actually. I've met christian, conservative, Swedish country-side folk who frown on anything the government considers illegal or drugs. But at the same time will use catnip on a new cat toy as a tool to make the cat take to it. Or just watch it roll around for their own amusement. Maybe that's a fringe example but I have had that experience a couple times. More often I have contact with younger people in their 20s and 30s who don't view human drugs as anything morally wrong and just enjoy giving their cat what they assume is enjoyment.
jerf 6y ago
"I never quite understood why catnip was so socially acceptable when we view other drugs with such different eyes." Do you treat "drugs are bad" as an axiomatic statement, or do you accept "drugs are bad" as the contingent conclusion of a series of more fundamental statements? We drill the former into (young) children because it is true enough for them, and they aren't ready for the latter. If you can understand the latter, then take the underlying statements, and apply them to the cats. You'll find most of them simply don't apply to cats. Maybe a couple of them slightly do, but none of them work like humans. Humans have a unique capacity to be affected by drugs due to our superb executive functioning. Non-humans are all but incapable of bending their entire life around drug-seeking behavior the way we are partially because we're really good at making them, and also because we're uniquely good at refining them. (It's a long cognitive distance from "let the fruit sit a while to taste fun" to "let's build a still!".)
idlewords 6y ago
I started off giving my catnip once every few weeks or so. Soon it was multiple times a day. Now the cat just lies around on the sofa all day, waiting for the next fix. I dare not stop because I fear its claws. The active, happy animal I knew is gone, replaced by this sleepy, torpid monster—just another victim of catnip addiction.
Sohcahtoa82 6y ago
Yes, it is to see them have fun. The cats definitely appear to enjoy it. My cat has learned to recognize the sound of me opening the tub of catnip and will come running across the house to get some. Good for them? Maybe. It's certainly not bad for them. This has been very much studied. Cats can't overdose on catnip. At worst, after 5-15 minutes of sniffing and rolling around in it, they stop responding to it. > when we view other drugs with such different eyes. Because most drugs humans take are harmful. The hard stuff like meth, cocaine, heroin, etc., is easy to overdose on. Alcohol can make some people belligerent and can easily be deadly. Tobacco causes cancer, among other things depending on how you consume it. Marijuana is the least harmful, but as far as I'm concerned, the jury is still out on whether or not it's as harmless as people think it is, especially if smoked. But catnip? It's completely harmless. The cat will sniff or eat it, roll around in it, and appears to experience euphoria, but there are no health dangers in it.
- Koshkin 6y ago
  > Tobacco causes cancer To be fair, tobacco isn’t the drug, it’s nicotine, and nicotine does not cause cancer. (But I’m sure you knew that.)
rconti 6y ago
If you keep drugging your cats, they'll never be able to hold down a job.

chmaynard 6y ago

A thought-provoking question, thanks for asking.

lreeves 6y ago

For the same reason I smoke weed. They clearly love it and it has no adverse effects (just don't let them eat it, use it in toys).

the-dude 6y ago
> has no adverse effects I used to think that too. And I still smoke ( hash, which is different ). However, it does make me complacent, which sometimes make me endure situations I would otherwise change.
- lreeves 6y ago
  Oh I meant catnip, haha. I think pot definitely has some mild side-effects for sure.
- _underfl0w_ 6y ago
  Complacency is a huge downside. I'm also much less motivated to work on side projects. Not to mention the toll on the lungs. Ask Willie Nelson if you'd like anecdata about how that can play out over a lifetime. I've recently made the leap to edibles exclusively after a stint with a hot-air vaporizer (a la Volcano devices) and I now find the resin smell of smoking incredibly off-putting. The coughing, hacking, and lung stiffness that results from a bong rip even more so. Doesn't lessen the complacency, but the delay your metabolism introduces can help you get started on projects before it sets in!

aaron_m04 6y ago

> Is it to see them have fun? Is it so the owners have fun? Yes

waheoo 6y ago
How dare you?! Won't someone think of the kitty cats?

dylan604 6y ago

Not all humans view drugs in the same manner. In some locales, it is accepted to use drugs recreationally. Other places deem that same usage unacceptable. If you look at the similarity in the gov'ts that deem that usage as unacceptable, there's a common overall belief that is not scientifically based.

dalbasal 6y ago
Some sort of drug is usually acceptable culturally. Alcohol, very widely. Cannabis, more recently. Mild drugs like coffee. "Prescribed recreationals" like xanax in some circles. In many places Hashish or opium are still seen as traditional/acceptable. I grew up in Israel, where qat is legal, seen as equivalent to coffee and culturally acceptable. It's fairly common as an ornamental plant. Giving your cat whiskey would cause an uproar, but I guess catnip gets a grandfather exception.
- pushrax 6y ago
  As far as anyone knows, catnip is completely nontoxic to cats, but ethanol certainly is toxic. Cats also simply don't like the smell of alcohol. Eating very large quantities of catnip can give them gastrointestinal discomfort though.
  - dalbasal 6y ago
    Sure, I wasn't recommending it. I'm just pointing out that it's culturally acceptable to give cats catnip. Culture happens, and sometimes it's rational. Sometimes it's not.

TulliusCicero 6y ago

The impact of recreational drugs is often seen as destructive, in terms of basic physical health, or behavior (e.g. addiction). If catnip isn't destroying cats' lives, what's the harm?

elliekelly 6y ago

Along the same lines, does it gives cats a “hangover” of sorts afterwards? The article describes catnip as similar to heroin for humans. I’ve never done heroin but I would imagine the withdrawal is really unpleasant which is what then causes addiction. Do cats experience the same come down? Can cats get addicted to catnip if they have access to an unlimited supply?

echoradio 6y ago
The behavior I notice with my cats when they have some ‘nip is they get a little active then have a time where they just mellow out. But cats also sleep about 16 hours a day, so it is hard to determine at what point being mellow shifts into their typical nap time. I don’t think there’s a long-term tolerance that builds up. I get the sense it is short-acting. I’ve read once a cat has catnip, giving them more in a 15-20 minute window is pointless because they’ve already been “activated” by it. They need to come down from the initial dose first. My cats’ vet has suggested to use catnip to encourage activity (they’re a big chunky and need some exercise).
dokem 6y ago
I bought a ton of catnip and my cat seemed to become indifferent to it pretty quickly. Maybe it just dried out, though.

derefr 6y ago

In general: if an animal is observed to purposefully do something in the wild, and that thing isn’t known to be harmful to the animal, then most people will consider that thing to be a valid “enrichment” activity — i.e. something that would be good to offer as an activity for animals of that species, in captivity, to engage in when they seem bored/understimulated. I don’t know about cats with catnip specifically, but many wild animals are observed to purposefully seek out and consume rotten (i.e. fermented, alcoholic) fruit to get drunk/high. (We know that alcohol is harmful to animals, so we don’t tend to offer e.g. captive apes rotten fruit; but we also don’t really stop them from hoarding fruit to make it become rotten, and then eating it. It’s a natural thing that they do. Cats gonna scratch each-other up play-fighting. Apes gonna drink.) But why do we have such a different mindset toward this? I think one big difference is that the human social norms on the acceptable recreational activities for humans are mostly defined/circumscribed by what doctors think is okay (i.e. we take the lead of the medical establishment — if doctors are chill about something, there isn’t usually a social norm against it, while if doctors get upset, other people also get upset.) And doctors don’t like recreational drugs very much, because they usually think in a “harm reduction” mindset rather than a QALY mindset: they’d rather decrease “risk of a loss of capability to experience a satisfying life”, than increase “the area-under-the-curve of satisfying-life-years.” Meanwhile, the human social norms on the acceptable recreational activities for animals are mostly defined/circumscribed by what zoologists think is okay. Zoologists are the people with voices and platforms to talk about animals, since engaging in animal conservation and study tends to directly correlate with seeking funding for that conservation and study, which is usually implemented through educational outreach activities (i.e. building zoos/aquariums/nature parks, giving tours in conservation areas, etc.) And zoologists, traditionally(?), mostly care about what they observe happening in nature. The whole field of zoology is built on observing animals in nature to figure out “what they do.” So our norms on animal recreation lean much more toward “natural ⇒ good” (regardless of harm potential) than “potentially harmful ⇒ bad” (regardless of naturalness.) If veterinarians had the voices and platforms instead, I assume you’d see much more of a harm-reduction mindset in our social norms toward animal recreation.

nkrisc 6y ago

I think most people realize the futility of trying to apply human morality to non-human animals.

echoradio 6y ago

Your post reminded me of this humorous drug education film parody: https://vimeo.com/44733000 https://vimeo.com/44733000

shaftway 6y ago
I clicked on that fully expecting it to be the demonstration of various drugs on spiders: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2HipedgM3I https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2HipedgM3I

INTPenis 6y ago

You raise a really good point actually. I've met christian, conservative, Swedish country-side folk who frown on anything the government considers illegal or drugs. But at the same time will use catnip on a new cat toy as a tool to make the cat take to it. Or just watch it roll around for their own amusement. Maybe that's a fringe example but I have had that experience a couple times. More often I have contact with younger people in their 20s and 30s who don't view human drugs as anything morally wrong and just enjoy giving their cat what they assume is enjoyment.

jerf 6y ago

"I never quite understood why catnip was so socially acceptable when we view other drugs with such different eyes." Do you treat "drugs are bad" as an axiomatic statement, or do you accept "drugs are bad" as the contingent conclusion of a series of more fundamental statements? We drill the former into (young) children because it is true enough for them, and they aren't ready for the latter. If you can understand the latter, then take the underlying statements, and apply them to the cats. You'll find most of them simply don't apply to cats. Maybe a couple of them slightly do, but none of them work like humans. Humans have a unique capacity to be affected by drugs due to our superb executive functioning. Non-humans are all but incapable of bending their entire life around drug-seeking behavior the way we are partially because we're really good at making them, and also because we're uniquely good at refining them. (It's a long cognitive distance from "let the fruit sit a while to taste fun" to "let's build a still!".)

idlewords 6y ago

I started off giving my catnip once every few weeks or so. Soon it was multiple times a day. Now the cat just lies around on the sofa all day, waiting for the next fix. I dare not stop because I fear its claws. The active, happy animal I knew is gone, replaced by this sleepy, torpid monster—just another victim of catnip addiction.

Sohcahtoa82 6y ago

Yes, it is to see them have fun. The cats definitely appear to enjoy it. My cat has learned to recognize the sound of me opening the tub of catnip and will come running across the house to get some. Good for them? Maybe. It's certainly not bad for them. This has been very much studied. Cats can't overdose on catnip. At worst, after 5-15 minutes of sniffing and rolling around in it, they stop responding to it. > when we view other drugs with such different eyes. Because most drugs humans take are harmful. The hard stuff like meth, cocaine, heroin, etc., is easy to overdose on. Alcohol can make some people belligerent and can easily be deadly. Tobacco causes cancer, among other things depending on how you consume it. Marijuana is the least harmful, but as far as I'm concerned, the jury is still out on whether or not it's as harmless as people think it is, especially if smoked. But catnip? It's completely harmless. The cat will sniff or eat it, roll around in it, and appears to experience euphoria, but there are no health dangers in it.

Koshkin 6y ago
> Tobacco causes cancer To be fair, tobacco isn’t the drug, it’s nicotine, and nicotine does not cause cancer. (But I’m sure you knew that.)

rconti 6y ago

If you keep drugging your cats, they'll never be able to hold down a job.