5 ms·

Is he actually a terrible person, or merely one who happens to have unpopular opinions?

• burgerbrain 15y ago
  In my humble opinion, it is not unreasonable to judge a person by their publicly stated opinions.
  • hugh3 15y ago
    But where do you draw the line between "Opinions with which I disagree" and "Opinions which make you a bad person if you hold them"? I tend to classify really silly opinions as "loopy" rather than "evil", as long as they don't actually advocate violence or similar. OSC has loopy opinions, not immoral ones.
    • burgerbrain 15y ago
      Hateful and discriminatory seems like a decent line to me, but hey, its a judgement call. Decide for yourself.
      • michaeldhopkins 15y ago
        You don't want this recursion to apply to you too. Saying a person who says someone is terrible is terrible puts you next in line. Fortunately for both of us I don't think you're terrible, just a little too excited to dislike someone.
        • burgerbrain 15y ago
          You know what? I think I'm actually alright with someone thinking that I am terrible because I think that outspoken homophobes are terrible. Yeah, I am pretty sure that doesn't concern me in the slightest. Edit: fixed stupid corrective spelling thing...
          • deleted 15y ago
            [deleted]
          • chernevik 15y ago
            Is that because you are willing to fight it out? Or because you think you've got the people with the "wrong" opinions well out-numbered? Use your imagination and consider circumstances where people with the "right" opinions are outnumbered, and considered dangerous. I _hope_ that I'd be saying the right things in Berlin 1935, or Richmond 1855, or Birmingham 1958, or Moscow 1920 - 1985. But I'm damn sure I'd be _concerned_ about the reaction to those remarks.
            • burgerbrain 15y ago
              I mean I am not going to lose sleep over people thinking less of me for disliking homophobes. I won't be persuaded to modify my opinions by warnings that the people I dislike (homophobes) will dislike me in return.
              • chernevik 15y ago
                And you've already dismissed the possibility that they actually have reasons for their opinions, or you wouldn't refer to them with a pejorative. So it looks like nothing could persuade to change your mind. The problem with these "homophobes" is their closed minds, right?
                • burgerbrain 15y ago
                  I don't care what their reasons are, nor have I ever doubted that they have them. Racists have reasons too, simply having a reason is worthless.
          • michaeldhopkins 15y ago
            Okay, then follow the recursion back the other way. You should expect them to care as little about what you think as you care about what I think. It seems either you believe your opposites have a more open mind than you do (so you can convince them despite your unconcern about being perceived as being like them), or you are writing opinions you hope your intended audience will like so they will like you. Perhaps you are writing for a judging God or people you consider to be your social superiors (people who can upvote.) You might reply that you write your opinions only for yourself, but because you wrote them here instead of a desktop text editor I think you want some other benefit.
      • CWuestefeld 15y ago
        Hateful and discriminatory seems like a decent line to me To me, you sound like the thought police. In my moral code, we're entitled to think what we want, and nobody has any business condemning us based on our thoughts. The line is our actions: if we do something to someone as a result of our thoughts, that crosses the line. I've said to a few gay friends that I personally think that homosexuality is gross; but I also think that broccoli is gross. The fact that I feel that way doesn't have anything to do with the way I view them as people, and certainly not how I treat them -- not any more than my distaste for broccoli affects my relationship with eaters of broccoli. And everyone I've talked about this attitude with seems to think it's a perfectly reasonable one to hold.
        • Pooter 15y ago
          >> Hateful and discriminatory seems like a decent line to me > To me, you sound like the thought police. You sound like a dishonest jackass, or someone who can't bother reading to the end of the single line post he's responding to, which reads: >... but hey, its a judgement call. Decide for yourself. Which is essentially the opposite of being "the thought police." Also, it's great that gay people are cool with you thinking broccoli and their sexuality are gross. You should tell that story again, bro.
        • burgerbrain 15y ago
          You and Scott Card are both entitled to your own opinions and moral beliefs. And I am entitled to call people who spout anti-homosexual hate speech homophobes on the internet. Furthermore: if Scott Card's stated opinions on homosexuality were as.. mellow.. as yours, then you wouldn't see me caring quite so much. I'm not sure why you're defending yourself when I'm talking about Scott Card...
  • stavrianos 15y ago
    I generally agree, so long as you remember that talk is cheap. If you shouldn't respect someone too much for talking about the great things they'll do, you shouldn't hold it too hard against someone for talking about terrible positions.
    • burgerbrain 15y ago
      Expressing hateful ideas about others and bragging about oneself are hardly opposite concepts. Slightly tangential, but generally both negative. If however, someone expresses and endorses kind and progressive social statements, I certainly do use that when judging their character.
  • grandalf 15y ago
    Sure it's reasonable. But do I judge Steve Jobs by what toppings he likes on his pizza or what kind of rap he listens to? No. I may agree or disagree with him, but his opinions on those matters have no bearing whatsoever on my primary relationship with him, which is as a purchaser of the hardware and software he designs. Similarly with Card, I am a reader of his fiction and so I don't care what color socks he wears, how often he showers, or whether he has a framed picture of Ronald McDonald on his wall.
    • burgerbrain 15y ago
      Preferred pizza toppings are in no way comparable to homophobic statements.
      • grandalf 15y ago
        I think they are equivalent b/c both are simply aesthetic preferences. Neither is trying to persuade others to adopt his aesthetic preference. Neither is an expert on the topic being opined about. At best one might claim that such a statement is ignorant. I think we start to get into trouble when we assume that an expert in one narrow area (such as fiction writing) should be/act non-ignorant in other areas of life. That is wishful thinking. It also suggests that we ought to expect "more" from someone with a narrow talent. Should a NFL player have perfect spelling? Should an olympic pole vaulter have a nuanced understanding of morality? Human aptitude is very narrow and we should appreciate it where we find it and not look to put anyone on a broad pedestal.
        • stonemetal 15y ago
          Neither is trying to persuade others to adopt his aesthetic preference. He wishes to make it illegal how is that not pushing his views on others?
          • grandalf 15y ago
            Citation?
• zavulon 15y ago
  Hear, hear. I didn't find anything in this interview that identifies him as a "terrible person". Yes, things he says are unpopular on the internet, given the internet's demographics - young, liberal, etc. But I think someone who calls him a "terrible person" based only on views he expressed hasn't met many terrible people in their lifetime. And before I get accused of being his fanboy, I can't stand Ender's Game. I think it's the most overrated piece of garbage in history of sci-fi.. sometimes it reads like a work of a 12 year old. Terrible writing, worse, incredibly naive plot, I have no idea how it can be considered a "classic" and works by far better sci-fi authors like Clifford Simak, Robert Sheckley, Henry Kuttner, Alfred Bester, etc are unfairly forgotten. Having said that, I think the Card's masterpiece is the insults he wrote for Monkey Island game... now that's a great piece of writing!