4 ms·

I'm very excited about this. This isn't going to replace farms anytime soon, but there's a pretty solid economic niche for it within the food choices that custo

by AlanSE 6y ago

I'm very excited about this. This isn't going to replace farms anytime soon, but there's a pretty solid economic niche for it within the food choices that customer preference justifies today. The best argument for this method of food production is by looking at criticism of existing food production. https://www.consumerreports.org/pesticides-in-food/stop-eating-pesticides/ https://www.consumerreports.org/pesticides-in-food/stop-eati... Reading stuff like this is truly, deeply, depressing. In our modern lives, we are supposed to eat lots of vegetables (which we don't), but we're also supposed be picky about which ones we get. Just the thought of that is exhausting. Also lookup salmonella outbreaks. How, you might ask, does salmonella get into lettuce? You will probably be grossed out to hear the answer. Vertical farms offer consumers several things which are almost impossible to come by otherwise. This is extraordinarily good to have for market entry. Higher energy use is a strike, but you have to consider the whole picture. I definitely think there's a place for this, the benefits that offset higher energy intensity are very substantive.

stretchcat 6y ago
> Also lookup salmonella outbreaks. How, you might ask, does salmonella get into lettuce? You will probably be grossed out to hear the answer. Spoiler: field workers who don't get bathroom breaks. I think a lot of people don't understand that farming is messy work. After highschool I worked at a bean processing plant where my job was to pick dead small animals (usually rodents, snakes, and frogs) out of the beans as they sped by on a conveyor belt. The machines needed to harvest the massive quantities of food our civilization requires do not discriminate between beans and the animals living in bean fields. But here is the thing; almost nobody gets sick from this. Wash your produce. Raccoons do it, and so should you. If you do, you'll almost certainly be fine just like nearly everybody else. It's gross, but it's not really a problem.
- jelliclesfarm 6y ago
  Salmonella is different. It can get into the plant. Stomata can absorb pathogens. Likely contaminated irrigation water.
  - stretchcat 6y ago
    Either way, you're not exactly dicing with death when you eat some lettuce. Sometimes there are outbreaks, but the CDC says about 420 die per year from salmonella, with 26k hospitalizations. That's virtually nothing when you consider how many people eat lettuce every day.
    - jelliclesfarm 6y ago
      That’s not how food security regulations work. We don’t play games with people’s lives. Lettuce has to be hydro cooled right after harvest..45 minutes after harvest. In Salinas etc, it’s done right on the field. It never gets out of refrigeration until customer buys it from store. There is enormous food wastage. Almost 40% of harvest is wasted even with top notch cold supply chain systems. When the public doesn’t trust the food they are playing dice with every mouthful of food. That’s just not acceptable. The risk from the farmers side is entirely different from how you consider food risks.
      - stretchcat 6y ago
        > When the public doesn’t trust the food they are playing dice with every mouthful of food. That’s just not acceptable. The public do trust lettuce. The current systems work well and billions of people trust their lives to it, with good results. Exceptionally few people are afraid of eating regular store bought lettuce. Nobody is talking about "playing games" so I have no idea what you're on about there. I never suggested that food production be deregulated, that would be insanity.
        jelliclesfarm 6y ago
        They are able to trust it only because the last rung of the supply chain..the grocery store..discards and wastes so much produce to put out only the best and prettiest looking produce on the shelves. The wastage is enormous...and unconscionable.
        6y ago
jelliclesfarm 6y ago
There has only been one instance when spinach was contaminated with e.coli. Two things: Americans like to eat their greens raw. Which is weird to most of the rest of the world. At least 3 billion people think that it’s nuts. 2. In that particular instance, it was traced back to a pig that got lost and likely contaminated due to some animal that died during mechanical harvest. Greens get contaminated because of contaminated water too. It’s very simple. Wash your vegetables. Wash your hands while cooking. Cook your greens and vegetables. It’s not rocket science.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

by AlanSE 6y ago

stretchcat 6y ago

> Also lookup salmonella outbreaks. How, you might ask, does salmonella get into lettuce? You will probably be grossed out to hear the answer. Spoiler: field workers who don't get bathroom breaks. I think a lot of people don't understand that farming is messy work. After highschool I worked at a bean processing plant where my job was to pick dead small animals (usually rodents, snakes, and frogs) out of the beans as they sped by on a conveyor belt. The machines needed to harvest the massive quantities of food our civilization requires do not discriminate between beans and the animals living in bean fields. But here is the thing; almost nobody gets sick from this. Wash your produce. Raccoons do it, and so should you. If you do, you'll almost certainly be fine just like nearly everybody else. It's gross, but it's not really a problem.

jelliclesfarm 6y ago
Salmonella is different. It can get into the plant. Stomata can absorb pathogens. Likely contaminated irrigation water.
- stretchcat 6y ago
  Either way, you're not exactly dicing with death when you eat some lettuce. Sometimes there are outbreaks, but the CDC says about 420 die per year from salmonella, with 26k hospitalizations. That's virtually nothing when you consider how many people eat lettuce every day.
  - jelliclesfarm 6y ago
    That’s not how food security regulations work. We don’t play games with people’s lives. Lettuce has to be hydro cooled right after harvest..45 minutes after harvest. In Salinas etc, it’s done right on the field. It never gets out of refrigeration until customer buys it from store. There is enormous food wastage. Almost 40% of harvest is wasted even with top notch cold supply chain systems. When the public doesn’t trust the food they are playing dice with every mouthful of food. That’s just not acceptable. The risk from the farmers side is entirely different from how you consider food risks.
    - stretchcat 6y ago
      > When the public doesn’t trust the food they are playing dice with every mouthful of food. That’s just not acceptable. The public do trust lettuce. The current systems work well and billions of people trust their lives to it, with good results. Exceptionally few people are afraid of eating regular store bought lettuce. Nobody is talking about "playing games" so I have no idea what you're on about there. I never suggested that food production be deregulated, that would be insanity.
      - jelliclesfarm 6y ago
        They are able to trust it only because the last rung of the supply chain..the grocery store..discards and wastes so much produce to put out only the best and prettiest looking produce on the shelves. The wastage is enormous...and unconscionable.
        6y ago

jelliclesfarm 6y ago

There has only been one instance when spinach was contaminated with e.coli. Two things: Americans like to eat their greens raw. Which is weird to most of the rest of the world. At least 3 billion people think that it’s nuts. 2. In that particular instance, it was traced back to a pig that got lost and likely contaminated due to some animal that died during mechanical harvest. Greens get contaminated because of contaminated water too. It’s very simple. Wash your vegetables. Wash your hands while cooking. Cook your greens and vegetables. It’s not rocket science.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]