4 ms·

Yeah dude. The Chinese are so technologically advanced, that they built an AI robot that looks exactly like the real Jack Ma. The real Jack Ma is getting his k

Yeah dude. The Chinese are so technologically advanced, that they built an AI robot that looks exactly like the real Jack Ma. The real Jack Ma is getting his kidneys harvested right now, because apparently, that’s what the CCP does to their own citizens (according to western media). /s

sebmellen 6y ago
They literally do harvest organs from their own citizens. That's not up for dispute. See https://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-china-rights-idUSKCN1TI236 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-china-rights-idUS....
- dirtyid 6y ago
  FLG affiliated china tribunal / ETAC is propaganda on par with epochetimes / qanon in terms of credibility. They launder their claims via US NGOs to MSM - turducken of creating misinformation. Prior to current China/FVEY spat, formal government level investigations by AU/US have found FLG sponsored reports to be non-credible. https://web.archive.org/web/20120205064042/http://www.usembassy.it/pdf/other/RL33437.pdf https://web.archive.org/web/20120205064042/http://www.usemba... https://www.refworld.org/pdfid/4b6fe16df.pdf https://www.refworld.org/pdfid/4b6fe16df.pdf https://web.archive.org/web/20090620050738/http://www.america.gov/st/washfile-english/2006/None/20060416141157uhyggep0.5443231.html https://web.archive.org/web/20090620050738/http://www.americ... At this time, Chinese political structure was _thoroughly_ infiltrated by CIA assets. There's also orthogonal indicators like amount of immuno-suppressant drugs in Chinese market cannot support a vast shadow organ harvesting system like FLG claims. There's a reason no credible institutions without FLG sponsorship have ever endorsed these findings. Including Mike Pompeo, at the urging for US lawmakers no less, who got drunk on FLG/epochtime coolaid. There's a special tier of ridiculous claims when even Pompeo can't spin it against China. FLG organ harvesting / vivisection has always been atrocity porn for useful idiots. It shouldn't be surprising these narratives are finally gaining traction during a period where media landscape is generating loads of them, when epochetimes is the #1 news paper on the appstore. I say this as someone with several FLG family members who was prosecuted in China, they are delusional cultists. Everything is peaceful and good intensions until they convince themselves not to seek medical advice and dies from completely preventable illnesses.
  - sebmellen 6y ago
    Uh, should they be prosecuted or persecuted for holding cultist views or not seeking medical treatment? I don't think so, maybe you do. If so, we have irreconcilable differences... Also — I didn't know the Epoch Times was the #1 newspaper in the App Store. I'm definitely not on that side of the political spectrum, if that's your worry. My concerns about China come more from a progressive perspective. That said, I do think the treatment of Falun Gong in China is atrocious, and I have some Falun Gong friends/acquaintances in the Netherlands (perhaps a bias). Organ harvesting is a real problem in China, whether on a small scale (https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-55097424 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-55097424) or large scale (read through this article and souces https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_harvesting_from_Falun_Gong_practitioners_in_China#Evidence https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_harvesting_from_Falun_...).
    - dirtyid 6y ago
      You can find repression is immoral without wholesale endorsing fake narratives from questionable sources. I have very nice friends who are antivax, does not mean I endorse their views from infowars. FLG is no different. They're the one dissident group where human right lawyers in China, who risk their necks for a variety of causes, still could not corroborate their fantastic claims. Sometimes friends/acquaintances/family believe fake things, which is even less wild if said belief stems from being in a cult. Black market organ trading is real problem but also stop gap solution in China, a country with abysmally low organ donation rates that's improving since reforms. Reference per capita transplant rate, China is 1/4 of west, however large the market, it isn't enough to provide even parity availability, not to mention large numbers goes towards transplant tourism for western customers who never seem to get appropriate denouncement from FLG despite their massive discourse power. It takes two to tango. At the end of the day, there are irreconcilable priorities and moral calculus due to differences in culture and development. CN transplant system is moving in the right direction - FLG didn't convince west to stop getting transplants in China, CCP had to legislate against when the time was right. Things improve incrementally, otherwise FLG would need to resurrect long debunked accusations to suit their agenda.

sebmellen 6y ago

They literally do harvest organs from their own citizens. That's not up for dispute. See https://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-china-rights-idUSKCN1TI236 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-china-rights-idUS....

dirtyid 6y ago
FLG affiliated china tribunal / ETAC is propaganda on par with epochetimes / qanon in terms of credibility. They launder their claims via US NGOs to MSM - turducken of creating misinformation. Prior to current China/FVEY spat, formal government level investigations by AU/US have found FLG sponsored reports to be non-credible. https://web.archive.org/web/20120205064042/http://www.usembassy.it/pdf/other/RL33437.pdf https://web.archive.org/web/20120205064042/http://www.usemba... https://www.refworld.org/pdfid/4b6fe16df.pdf https://www.refworld.org/pdfid/4b6fe16df.pdf https://web.archive.org/web/20090620050738/http://www.america.gov/st/washfile-english/2006/None/20060416141157uhyggep0.5443231.html https://web.archive.org/web/20090620050738/http://www.americ... At this time, Chinese political structure was _thoroughly_ infiltrated by CIA assets. There's also orthogonal indicators like amount of immuno-suppressant drugs in Chinese market cannot support a vast shadow organ harvesting system like FLG claims. There's a reason no credible institutions without FLG sponsorship have ever endorsed these findings. Including Mike Pompeo, at the urging for US lawmakers no less, who got drunk on FLG/epochtime coolaid. There's a special tier of ridiculous claims when even Pompeo can't spin it against China. FLG organ harvesting / vivisection has always been atrocity porn for useful idiots. It shouldn't be surprising these narratives are finally gaining traction during a period where media landscape is generating loads of them, when epochetimes is the #1 news paper on the appstore. I say this as someone with several FLG family members who was prosecuted in China, they are delusional cultists. Everything is peaceful and good intensions until they convince themselves not to seek medical advice and dies from completely preventable illnesses.
- sebmellen 6y ago
  Uh, should they be prosecuted or persecuted for holding cultist views or not seeking medical treatment? I don't think so, maybe you do. If so, we have irreconcilable differences... Also — I didn't know the Epoch Times was the #1 newspaper in the App Store. I'm definitely not on that side of the political spectrum, if that's your worry. My concerns about China come more from a progressive perspective. That said, I do think the treatment of Falun Gong in China is atrocious, and I have some Falun Gong friends/acquaintances in the Netherlands (perhaps a bias). Organ harvesting is a real problem in China, whether on a small scale (https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-55097424 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-55097424) or large scale (read through this article and souces https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_harvesting_from_Falun_Gong_practitioners_in_China#Evidence https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_harvesting_from_Falun_...).
  - dirtyid 6y ago
    You can find repression is immoral without wholesale endorsing fake narratives from questionable sources. I have very nice friends who are antivax, does not mean I endorse their views from infowars. FLG is no different. They're the one dissident group where human right lawyers in China, who risk their necks for a variety of causes, still could not corroborate their fantastic claims. Sometimes friends/acquaintances/family believe fake things, which is even less wild if said belief stems from being in a cult. Black market organ trading is real problem but also stop gap solution in China, a country with abysmally low organ donation rates that's improving since reforms. Reference per capita transplant rate, China is 1/4 of west, however large the market, it isn't enough to provide even parity availability, not to mention large numbers goes towards transplant tourism for western customers who never seem to get appropriate denouncement from FLG despite their massive discourse power. It takes two to tango. At the end of the day, there are irreconcilable priorities and moral calculus due to differences in culture and development. CN transplant system is moving in the right direction - FLG didn't convince west to stop getting transplants in China, CCP had to legislate against when the time was right. Things improve incrementally, otherwise FLG would need to resurrect long debunked accusations to suit their agenda.