6 ms·

I don't know what's the solution. I'm trying to get back to linux but then my suspend doesn't work, touchpad feels sluggish and my battery lasts 2 hours instead

I don't know what's the solution. I'm trying to get back to linux but then my suspend doesn't work, touchpad feels sluggish and my battery lasts 2 hours instead of 7+. Not to mention things like https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25843874 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25843874

lmilcin 6y ago
There are tools to debug power issues on Linux laptops. I use these from time to time especially when I am going to be sailing for couple of days. I can use my t440s (7yo) for over 24 hours on three batteries, internal 3 cell, and external 3 cell and 9 cell. I use it for light development, reading PDFs, some web, etc. There are also laptops that are more Linux friendly than others. It is best to buy laptop specifically for Linux use and do research before the purchase.
- mstipetic 6y ago
  Maybe I'm being an asshole and should "submit a patch" but I really get annoyed when basic things don't work. I'm happy to debug custom software, but I don't understand how things like battery management isn't solved. I've used it on many laptops including a fully specced Dell XPS 13 (which burned out after a small spill on the keyboard)
  - lmilcin 6y ago
    Mine was once drenched completely in hot sweet latte and once submerged in mineral water (don't ask how...) It still works with no issues even though both times I had to disassemble completely and wash all parts including motherboard. The mineral water got between lcd leaves so I had to separate, wash and dry individual layers of LCD. My tip is to always have IPA, distilled water and tools to disassemble and clean your laptop.
    - oAlbe 6y ago
      How do you wash electronic components without causing damage?
      - lmilcin 6y ago
        Most boards can be washed safely but there are some components that can be damaged. Safest method is to use distilled, deoxygenated water (aka electronic water) to remove most contaminants, followed by 99% isopropyl alcohol or 96% ethyl alcohol to remove the rest and also water. Don't skimp on water and alcohol, submerge the board and use brush while submerged, to pull and dilute contaminants. Just never use tap or mineral water. You can use regular distilled water as long as you do it quickly, but unless it is deoxygenated it will be corroding so don't leave it in water for long. Alcohol is there mostly to dilute water so that it dries out very quickly. Without alcohol water could stay under components for a long time and kill or damage your board. Alcohols can damage some plastic components, so don't keep it in alcohol fo too long, either.
      - Ardon 6y ago
        Water is not instantly harmful to unpowered electronics, especially distilled water. Just make sure there's no power and go to town.
        lmilcin 6y ago
        I would add that washing with water is normal part of board production. Fluxes are designed to be water soluble and a lot of fluxes are washed with water with addition of saponifiers. It is also normal to wash a board in ultrasonic cleaner after any rework or at the end of production process (especially in small scale production).
    - frongpik 6y ago
      Is it really worth your time?
      - lmilcin 6y ago
        Depends. If you decide it is not possible for you to spill on your laptop or the loss of your laptop is worth less than half a day of your time and keeping two bottles one of clean water and one of clean alcohol, then sure, just ignore this. On the other hand if you own an expensive machine that can be reasonably disassembled (ie. almost anything else than a Mac) and you plan to use it for a long time and you don't have any other insurance against spill, then you might be able to save a lot of money with a very small amount of effort. My laptop was fully beefed up Lenovo T440s and I live in Poland. In Poland, this laptop represented about 3-4 average monthly salaries. Not much compared to half a day of effort to disassemble, clean and reassemble again. Half a day assumes you have no idea what you are doing and you are need extra time to figure out what to do, find videos on Internet, figure out why you can't pull a part and what still keeps it in place, etc. For a person that knows what they are doing this is half an hour of effort.
        frongpik 6y ago
        There's also a big risk of repair going wrong. But you're right: I was judging the situation from the SV bubble.
  - 3np 6y ago
    That horrible battery life on Ubuntu on an XPS 13 sounds like something else wrong. Several of my coworkers are running exactly that (over different generations even) and it's been with no tweaks.
  - modo_mario 6y ago
    What distro and laptop do you use currently? It's indeed annoying. More so that it generally is solved but is to be found somewhere in the fragmented linux ecosystem. I had no issues with my laptop and it worked better than windows which turns it into a jetengine for some reason except for bluetooth earbuds for which i needed a fork of pulseaudio or so....
    - mstipetic 6y ago
      Right now I'm back to osx but I'm really missing a good tiling manager like i3wm. As for the future I'm looking at system76 desktops, but still undecided (especially since apple's m1 hardware)
jayjader 6y ago
With regards to the battery issues, I'd suggest seeing if the TLP utility is available in your distro's packages. It's more than doubled battery "life" (== time to discharge) for me.
everdrive 6y ago
Perhaps this is why I always hear it's the year of the linux desktop.
- klodolph 6y ago
  Linux desktop has been falling behind, IMO.
  - everdrive 6y ago
    How do you feel it is falling behind? Not disagreeing or agreeing, just curious for your thoughts.
    - klodolph 6y ago
      In the march forwards, e.g. GNOME 2 -> GNOME 3, there are a number of regressions mixed in with the improvements. I think tackling overall UX may be seen as unattractive work compared to tacking on new features. For example, GNOME Files (formerly Nautilus) and the GTK file chooser are not even as good as competitors from the 1990s (like the Mac or Windows equivalents). GIMP and Inkscape are also noticeable steps down from the equivalent software we used in the 1990s (not just the well-known Adobe products, but also products from Corel, Macromedia, etc.) My impression is that the Linux desktop is playing catch-up with the Windows and Mac desktops, but since Microsoft and Apple have better funding it’s an impossible job—the target is moving too fast. In an effort to catch up with modern UIs, features that used to work are getting broken or the UX is degrading. The GNOME 2 -> GNOME 3 switch is just one example. I’m not saying GNOME 2 is better than GNOME 3 overall, just that large-scale changes are moving too fast and the polish and long-term fixes are coming too slowly by comparison. Linux is usually my primary desktop and when I switch to my Mac it feels like a breath of fresh air.
fsflover 6y ago
You simply need a laptop which was designed for Linux, not the one on which you can install it. I recommend this one: https://puri.sm/products/librem-14 https://puri.sm/products/librem-14.
- lmilcin 6y ago
  I have used Thinkpads for decades with Linux. There are, of course, rough spots. But overall Thinkpads are just so much better machines.

lmilcin 6y ago

There are tools to debug power issues on Linux laptops. I use these from time to time especially when I am going to be sailing for couple of days. I can use my t440s (7yo) for over 24 hours on three batteries, internal 3 cell, and external 3 cell and 9 cell. I use it for light development, reading PDFs, some web, etc. There are also laptops that are more Linux friendly than others. It is best to buy laptop specifically for Linux use and do research before the purchase.

mstipetic 6y ago
Maybe I'm being an asshole and should "submit a patch" but I really get annoyed when basic things don't work. I'm happy to debug custom software, but I don't understand how things like battery management isn't solved. I've used it on many laptops including a fully specced Dell XPS 13 (which burned out after a small spill on the keyboard)
- lmilcin 6y ago
  Mine was once drenched completely in hot sweet latte and once submerged in mineral water (don't ask how...) It still works with no issues even though both times I had to disassemble completely and wash all parts including motherboard. The mineral water got between lcd leaves so I had to separate, wash and dry individual layers of LCD. My tip is to always have IPA, distilled water and tools to disassemble and clean your laptop.
  - oAlbe 6y ago
    How do you wash electronic components without causing damage?
    - lmilcin 6y ago
      Most boards can be washed safely but there are some components that can be damaged. Safest method is to use distilled, deoxygenated water (aka electronic water) to remove most contaminants, followed by 99% isopropyl alcohol or 96% ethyl alcohol to remove the rest and also water. Don't skimp on water and alcohol, submerge the board and use brush while submerged, to pull and dilute contaminants. Just never use tap or mineral water. You can use regular distilled water as long as you do it quickly, but unless it is deoxygenated it will be corroding so don't leave it in water for long. Alcohol is there mostly to dilute water so that it dries out very quickly. Without alcohol water could stay under components for a long time and kill or damage your board. Alcohols can damage some plastic components, so don't keep it in alcohol fo too long, either.
    - Ardon 6y ago
      Water is not instantly harmful to unpowered electronics, especially distilled water. Just make sure there's no power and go to town.
      - lmilcin 6y ago
        I would add that washing with water is normal part of board production. Fluxes are designed to be water soluble and a lot of fluxes are washed with water with addition of saponifiers. It is also normal to wash a board in ultrasonic cleaner after any rework or at the end of production process (especially in small scale production).
  - frongpik 6y ago
    Is it really worth your time?
    - lmilcin 6y ago
      Depends. If you decide it is not possible for you to spill on your laptop or the loss of your laptop is worth less than half a day of your time and keeping two bottles one of clean water and one of clean alcohol, then sure, just ignore this. On the other hand if you own an expensive machine that can be reasonably disassembled (ie. almost anything else than a Mac) and you plan to use it for a long time and you don't have any other insurance against spill, then you might be able to save a lot of money with a very small amount of effort. My laptop was fully beefed up Lenovo T440s and I live in Poland. In Poland, this laptop represented about 3-4 average monthly salaries. Not much compared to half a day of effort to disassemble, clean and reassemble again. Half a day assumes you have no idea what you are doing and you are need extra time to figure out what to do, find videos on Internet, figure out why you can't pull a part and what still keeps it in place, etc. For a person that knows what they are doing this is half an hour of effort.
      - frongpik 6y ago
        There's also a big risk of repair going wrong. But you're right: I was judging the situation from the SV bubble.
- 3np 6y ago
  That horrible battery life on Ubuntu on an XPS 13 sounds like something else wrong. Several of my coworkers are running exactly that (over different generations even) and it's been with no tweaks.
- modo_mario 6y ago
  What distro and laptop do you use currently? It's indeed annoying. More so that it generally is solved but is to be found somewhere in the fragmented linux ecosystem. I had no issues with my laptop and it worked better than windows which turns it into a jetengine for some reason except for bluetooth earbuds for which i needed a fork of pulseaudio or so....
  - mstipetic 6y ago
    Right now I'm back to osx but I'm really missing a good tiling manager like i3wm. As for the future I'm looking at system76 desktops, but still undecided (especially since apple's m1 hardware)

jayjader 6y ago

With regards to the battery issues, I'd suggest seeing if the TLP utility is available in your distro's packages. It's more than doubled battery "life" (== time to discharge) for me.

everdrive 6y ago

Perhaps this is why I always hear it's the year of the linux desktop.

klodolph 6y ago
Linux desktop has been falling behind, IMO.
- everdrive 6y ago
  How do you feel it is falling behind? Not disagreeing or agreeing, just curious for your thoughts.
  - klodolph 6y ago
    In the march forwards, e.g. GNOME 2 -> GNOME 3, there are a number of regressions mixed in with the improvements. I think tackling overall UX may be seen as unattractive work compared to tacking on new features. For example, GNOME Files (formerly Nautilus) and the GTK file chooser are not even as good as competitors from the 1990s (like the Mac or Windows equivalents). GIMP and Inkscape are also noticeable steps down from the equivalent software we used in the 1990s (not just the well-known Adobe products, but also products from Corel, Macromedia, etc.) My impression is that the Linux desktop is playing catch-up with the Windows and Mac desktops, but since Microsoft and Apple have better funding it’s an impossible job—the target is moving too fast. In an effort to catch up with modern UIs, features that used to work are getting broken or the UX is degrading. The GNOME 2 -> GNOME 3 switch is just one example. I’m not saying GNOME 2 is better than GNOME 3 overall, just that large-scale changes are moving too fast and the polish and long-term fixes are coming too slowly by comparison. Linux is usually my primary desktop and when I switch to my Mac it feels like a breath of fresh air.

fsflover 6y ago

You simply need a laptop which was designed for Linux, not the one on which you can install it. I recommend this one: https://puri.sm/products/librem-14 https://puri.sm/products/librem-14.

lmilcin 6y ago
I have used Thinkpads for decades with Linux. There are, of course, rough spots. But overall Thinkpads are just so much better machines.