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Do you deem there to be a difference since presumably the children's parents love the child but still choose to have them work? Again, I don't believe child la

by toolz 6y ago

Do you deem there to be a difference since presumably the children's parents love the child but still choose to have them work? Again, I don't believe child labor is ideal, but I do wonder if there's really a comparison to slavery, which was entirely compulsory.

enriquto 6y ago
> presumably the children's parents love the child but still choose to have them work Please, stop. Don't you realize you are making it worse? Still, it is funny to see you defend child labor as a cultural value, just to save Apple's face. Not sure Apple would appreciate your efforts, though.
- toolz 6y ago
  I'm sorry to see you disagree with me so strongly that you're unwilling to have a conversation. I hope you'll consider respecting your peers enough in the future to engage in conversation rather than dismissing their opinions.
munk-a 6y ago
I think there are some pretty significant parallels between slavery and child labour. IMO children aren't capable decision makers so a better place to begin the parallel might be comparing child labour to the abuse of those with mental disabilities or the elderly. The parents may or may not have their child's best interest at heart but they certainly have an outsized force of opinion when it comes to the child's actions. I think[1] that for slavery to exist in society there has to be a really strong psychological justification for the slavery on the part of the owners and that that rubs off on the owned - slave revolts were pretty immediately effective when they happened in the south but relatively rare and I think this is due an acceptance on slaves' parts that they were powerless to change their situation. If that view is effected then I think that children would be in a similar sort of situation as slaves - but I think abuse of the elderly or mentally disabled is a much clearer parallel to draw. That all said - I don't think that's the side of this issue that's problematic. I don't actually have a problem with children working when the economic situation requires it - I have a problem with companies that could improve that situation to remove the need to have child labour instead exploiting the situation to make more money. If a family was farming in complete isolation from the rest of the world and barely scraping by then I'd find it perfectly acceptable for the children to help with maintaining the farm as they are able - since the difference is between survival and death. 1. Heavy into opinion territory here so I wanted to clarify that none of this is intended to offend.
- toolz 6y ago
  hmm, thanks for the reply, I'm not sure I fully grasp the parallels of parents acting in the best interest of their family and abusing elderly or the disabled, but I can appreciate a perspective that finds child labor to be a net loss for society, personally I think it all hinges on cultural norms as happiness isn't determined by having the most freedom or money or choices, but rather seems to be tied to some sense of being pro-social and being capable of achieving goals. I believe there are cultures which can foster a strong sense of pro-social family building through child labor and thus it can be beneficial in that context.

by toolz 6y ago

enriquto 6y ago

> presumably the children's parents love the child but still choose to have them work Please, stop. Don't you realize you are making it worse? Still, it is funny to see you defend child labor as a cultural value, just to save Apple's face. Not sure Apple would appreciate your efforts, though.

toolz 6y ago
I'm sorry to see you disagree with me so strongly that you're unwilling to have a conversation. I hope you'll consider respecting your peers enough in the future to engage in conversation rather than dismissing their opinions.

munk-a 6y ago

I think there are some pretty significant parallels between slavery and child labour. IMO children aren't capable decision makers so a better place to begin the parallel might be comparing child labour to the abuse of those with mental disabilities or the elderly. The parents may or may not have their child's best interest at heart but they certainly have an outsized force of opinion when it comes to the child's actions. I think[1] that for slavery to exist in society there has to be a really strong psychological justification for the slavery on the part of the owners and that that rubs off on the owned - slave revolts were pretty immediately effective when they happened in the south but relatively rare and I think this is due an acceptance on slaves' parts that they were powerless to change their situation. If that view is effected then I think that children would be in a similar sort of situation as slaves - but I think abuse of the elderly or mentally disabled is a much clearer parallel to draw. That all said - I don't think that's the side of this issue that's problematic. I don't actually have a problem with children working when the economic situation requires it - I have a problem with companies that could improve that situation to remove the need to have child labour instead exploiting the situation to make more money. If a family was farming in complete isolation from the rest of the world and barely scraping by then I'd find it perfectly acceptable for the children to help with maintaining the farm as they are able - since the difference is between survival and death. 1. Heavy into opinion territory here so I wanted to clarify that none of this is intended to offend.

toolz 6y ago
hmm, thanks for the reply, I'm not sure I fully grasp the parallels of parents acting in the best interest of their family and abusing elderly or the disabled, but I can appreciate a perspective that finds child labor to be a net loss for society, personally I think it all hinges on cultural norms as happiness isn't determined by having the most freedom or money or choices, but rather seems to be tied to some sense of being pro-social and being capable of achieving goals. I believe there are cultures which can foster a strong sense of pro-social family building through child labor and thus it can be beneficial in that context.