4 ms·

> If people had called one another to prepare this, would we say that the phone was responsible for the attack? And would we try to ban phones? That's a moot p

by ardy42 6y ago

> If people had called one another to prepare this, would we say that the phone was responsible for the attack? And would we try to ban phones? That's a moot point, because an attack like this can't realistically be organized via one-to-one communication. It needs a broadcast medium, which the phone network isn't.

ruffrey 6y ago
It’s certainly easier with social media, but before that people used phones and in person meetings.
beaner 6y ago
Is CNN, a broadcast television network, considered a broadcast medium for attacks and terrorism for promoting and defending violent riots, and for giving reach to similar statements of support and justification from congress members such as AOC and Nancy Pelosi?
- andrewvc 6y ago
  The idea that this summers riots were at all comparable to an attack on our nation's legislative body as it certified results of an election is repugnant and absurd. Its easier to point fingers at the other side than take any blame for your own. The insurrection at the nations capitol is a singular event, one that Republicans need to reckon with on its own terms. Some have done this, and I applaud them. They are proving to be the grown ups in the room.
  - beaner 6y ago
    What makes you think I'm on a side? I see hypocrisy all around. I think the capitol protests should not have happened, and the people who participated in them should be held accountable. I agree with you that the capitol riots and the summer riots are incomparable. The summer riots were much worse, lasted longer, targeted innocents rather than political institutions, were widely excused and often promulgated by the newsmedia and politicians, are still talked about as if they were just, continually avoid criticism by cowardly saying that such points are a "distraction" in the face of things like the capitol riots, and use dishonest sleights of hand like the changing of language from "riot" to "attack" to gaslight.
- TheAceOfHearts 6y ago
  Could you give some concrete examples? I think the scale of events resulting from a statement are taken into consideration. Terrorists have sprung up after being radicalized by what they heard from one politician or another, but we typically won't consider the politician responsible for those actions. This probably starts going into whataboutism territory, but doesn't this stuff tend to go both ways? I'd postulate we can probably find a few damning quotes made on Fox as well. I'll note I'm very ignorant on this topic as I haven't actually watched television or any of these networks in years.
  - beaner 6y ago
    Examples are everywhere, you just have to not be in a bubble and be open to seeing it. I could keep going but you tell me, do you need more? AOC: "The whole point of protesting is to make ppl uncomfortable." [-1] Slate: "Non-violence is an important tool for protests, but so is violence" [0] Vox: "Riots are destructive, dangerous, and scary — but can lead to serious social reforms" [1] Pelosi: "we welcome the presence of these activists" vs "our election was hijacked" [2] "CNN Promoted Charged Leftist Rioter Who Masqueraded As Reporter Despite No Credentials, Urged Assault On Capitol" [3] Chris Cuomo: "Show me where it says that protests are supposed to be polite and peaceful" [4] Supercut of news media justifying and excusing riots: [5] Daily beast and salon writer Arthur Chu calling for explicit murder of people he calls Nazis: [6] Difference in tone & presentation of NYT covering violent riots: [7] Sally Kohn, USA today writer: "I don't like violent protests but I understand them" [8] Kamala Harris: "Protests should not let up" Maxine Waters "If you see anybody from that cabinet in a restaurant, in a department store... You get out and you create a crowd and you push back on them." Nancy Pelosi: "I just don't know why there aren't uprisings all over the country. Maybe there will be soon." Ayanna Pressley: "There needs to be unrest in the streets" (I would agree that some of the politicians' quotes are a little weak, but in the name of consistency, these are at least worse than some types of language from Trump that would be called out as violence.) [-1] https://twitter.com/AOC/status/1334184644707758080 https://twitter.com/AOC/status/1334184644707758080 [0] https://twitter.com/slate/status/1268415955937513473?lang=en https://twitter.com/slate/status/1268415955937513473?lang=en [1] https://www.vox.com/2015/4/30/8518681/protests-riots-work https://www.vox.com/2015/4/30/8518681/protests-riots-work [2] https://twitter.com/ConceptualJames/status/1348439232415752192 https://twitter.com/ConceptualJames/status/13484392324157521... [3] https://thenationalpulse.com/breaking/cnn-promoted-capitol-rioter/ https://thenationalpulse.com/breaking/cnn-promoted-capitol-r... [4] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAe86my9r7A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAe86my9r7A [5] https://twitter.com/tomselliott/status/1347302588434284544 https://twitter.com/tomselliott/status/1347302588434284544 [6] https://twitter.com/Malcolm_fleX48/status/1347186287757959173 https://twitter.com/Malcolm_fleX48/status/134718628775795917... [7] https://twitter.com/ConceptualJames/status/1347055222980550657 https://twitter.com/ConceptualJames/status/13470552229805506... [8] https://twitter.com/DineshDSouza/status/1346927304073744388 https://twitter.com/DineshDSouza/status/1346927304073744388 More: https://thefederalist.com/2021/01/08/10-times-democrats-urged-violence-against-trump-and-his-supporters/ https://thefederalist.com/2021/01/08/10-times-democrats-urge...
pokstad 6y ago
Really? How did past revolutions and terrorist attacks get organized? You realize most of world history existed before the Internet, right?
- ardy42 6y ago
  > Really? How did past revolutions and terrorist attacks get organized? You realize most of world history existed before the Internet, right? Yeah, of course. Broadcasting means one-to-many communication. Before modern technology, those things were organized using other kinds of one-to-many communication, such as in-person meetings, rallies, and through newspapers and other kinds of publications. Movements aren't organized one-to-one like on a telephone, because that's a far slower way of spreading a message. It's also an unreliable medium, as the children's game "telephone" shows.
  - imgabe 6y ago
    Phone trees are a well known and used method to broadcast information via the phone system.
    - ardy42 6y ago
      > Phone trees are a well known and used method to broadcast information via the phone system. And pretty bad at doing it. It's actually pretty funny to imagine someone trying to organize a movement via a phone tree.
      - philwelch 6y ago
        In my home town, we had a local group of mostly old folks, largely right-wing, who would have monthly luncheons with local politicians, and the group was literally called the Phone Tree because that’s how they organized. Although in this case the “Phone Tree” was a primitive robodialer owned by the head of the organization and used to disseminate recorded announcements of when the next luncheon was and who would be the guest/s.

by ardy42 6y ago

ruffrey 6y ago

It’s certainly easier with social media, but before that people used phones and in person meetings.

beaner 6y ago

Is CNN, a broadcast television network, considered a broadcast medium for attacks and terrorism for promoting and defending violent riots, and for giving reach to similar statements of support and justification from congress members such as AOC and Nancy Pelosi?

andrewvc 6y ago
The idea that this summers riots were at all comparable to an attack on our nation's legislative body as it certified results of an election is repugnant and absurd. Its easier to point fingers at the other side than take any blame for your own. The insurrection at the nations capitol is a singular event, one that Republicans need to reckon with on its own terms. Some have done this, and I applaud them. They are proving to be the grown ups in the room.
- beaner 6y ago
  What makes you think I'm on a side? I see hypocrisy all around. I think the capitol protests should not have happened, and the people who participated in them should be held accountable. I agree with you that the capitol riots and the summer riots are incomparable. The summer riots were much worse, lasted longer, targeted innocents rather than political institutions, were widely excused and often promulgated by the newsmedia and politicians, are still talked about as if they were just, continually avoid criticism by cowardly saying that such points are a "distraction" in the face of things like the capitol riots, and use dishonest sleights of hand like the changing of language from "riot" to "attack" to gaslight.
TheAceOfHearts 6y ago
Could you give some concrete examples? I think the scale of events resulting from a statement are taken into consideration. Terrorists have sprung up after being radicalized by what they heard from one politician or another, but we typically won't consider the politician responsible for those actions. This probably starts going into whataboutism territory, but doesn't this stuff tend to go both ways? I'd postulate we can probably find a few damning quotes made on Fox as well. I'll note I'm very ignorant on this topic as I haven't actually watched television or any of these networks in years.
- beaner 6y ago
  Examples are everywhere, you just have to not be in a bubble and be open to seeing it. I could keep going but you tell me, do you need more? AOC: "The whole point of protesting is to make ppl uncomfortable." [-1] Slate: "Non-violence is an important tool for protests, but so is violence" [0] Vox: "Riots are destructive, dangerous, and scary — but can lead to serious social reforms" [1] Pelosi: "we welcome the presence of these activists" vs "our election was hijacked" [2] "CNN Promoted Charged Leftist Rioter Who Masqueraded As Reporter Despite No Credentials, Urged Assault On Capitol" [3] Chris Cuomo: "Show me where it says that protests are supposed to be polite and peaceful" [4] Supercut of news media justifying and excusing riots: [5] Daily beast and salon writer Arthur Chu calling for explicit murder of people he calls Nazis: [6] Difference in tone & presentation of NYT covering violent riots: [7] Sally Kohn, USA today writer: "I don't like violent protests but I understand them" [8] Kamala Harris: "Protests should not let up" Maxine Waters "If you see anybody from that cabinet in a restaurant, in a department store... You get out and you create a crowd and you push back on them." Nancy Pelosi: "I just don't know why there aren't uprisings all over the country. Maybe there will be soon." Ayanna Pressley: "There needs to be unrest in the streets" (I would agree that some of the politicians' quotes are a little weak, but in the name of consistency, these are at least worse than some types of language from Trump that would be called out as violence.) [-1] https://twitter.com/AOC/status/1334184644707758080 https://twitter.com/AOC/status/1334184644707758080 [0] https://twitter.com/slate/status/1268415955937513473?lang=en https://twitter.com/slate/status/1268415955937513473?lang=en [1] https://www.vox.com/2015/4/30/8518681/protests-riots-work https://www.vox.com/2015/4/30/8518681/protests-riots-work [2] https://twitter.com/ConceptualJames/status/1348439232415752192 https://twitter.com/ConceptualJames/status/13484392324157521... [3] https://thenationalpulse.com/breaking/cnn-promoted-capitol-rioter/ https://thenationalpulse.com/breaking/cnn-promoted-capitol-r... [4] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAe86my9r7A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAe86my9r7A [5] https://twitter.com/tomselliott/status/1347302588434284544 https://twitter.com/tomselliott/status/1347302588434284544 [6] https://twitter.com/Malcolm_fleX48/status/1347186287757959173 https://twitter.com/Malcolm_fleX48/status/134718628775795917... [7] https://twitter.com/ConceptualJames/status/1347055222980550657 https://twitter.com/ConceptualJames/status/13470552229805506... [8] https://twitter.com/DineshDSouza/status/1346927304073744388 https://twitter.com/DineshDSouza/status/1346927304073744388 More: https://thefederalist.com/2021/01/08/10-times-democrats-urged-violence-against-trump-and-his-supporters/ https://thefederalist.com/2021/01/08/10-times-democrats-urge...

pokstad 6y ago

Really? How did past revolutions and terrorist attacks get organized? You realize most of world history existed before the Internet, right?

ardy42 6y ago
> Really? How did past revolutions and terrorist attacks get organized? You realize most of world history existed before the Internet, right? Yeah, of course. Broadcasting means one-to-many communication. Before modern technology, those things were organized using other kinds of one-to-many communication, such as in-person meetings, rallies, and through newspapers and other kinds of publications. Movements aren't organized one-to-one like on a telephone, because that's a far slower way of spreading a message. It's also an unreliable medium, as the children's game "telephone" shows.
- imgabe 6y ago
  Phone trees are a well known and used method to broadcast information via the phone system.
  - ardy42 6y ago
    > Phone trees are a well known and used method to broadcast information via the phone system. And pretty bad at doing it. It's actually pretty funny to imagine someone trying to organize a movement via a phone tree.
    - philwelch 6y ago
      In my home town, we had a local group of mostly old folks, largely right-wing, who would have monthly luncheons with local politicians, and the group was literally called the Phone Tree because that’s how they organized. Although in this case the “Phone Tree” was a primitive robodialer owned by the head of the organization and used to disseminate recorded announcements of when the next luncheon was and who would be the guest/s.