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Sorry, I don't want to live in the hell scape you described. I enjoy having a national identity (language, ethnicity, food, architecture, history, etc). It give

Sorry, I don't want to live in the hell scape you described. I enjoy having a national identity (language, ethnicity, food, architecture, history, etc). It gives me a sense of place and I view my country as basically my extended family (it's a small northern European country). If you have peoples from all over the world moving to my country then that sense of brotherhood breaks down. Sorry, but tribalism is real and it's natural. Maybe that's why places like the US that have all sorts of peoples trying to live together is much less cohesive than my country.

dusted 6y ago
Why do you view only your country as your extended family? Are your countrymen somehow better than the rest of the people on the planet? Why can't your sense of place be the entire world? How is that not better? To be able to show an entire planet to your children and ttell them, this here, is your home world, these are your people ? A tribe of a million members? Please! A tribe can't be larger the amount of people who can know each other, everything beyond that is something else, it's civilization.
- travelthrow4 6y ago
  Because visually the people in my country look the same as me, we share a similar history for many thousands of years, we have mostly very similar world view, etc. A person from India for example is going to look different, have a different religion, different history, and different world view.
  - dusted 6y ago
    Everyone looks visually different, and you will encounter, in your own country, a fellow countryman, or woman, whose parents are born in your country, who have the same nationality and legal status as yourself, but a different ancestry, maybe from India, that person will then, in your mind, not be your peer, simply because they look different? Even though you share culture and history and upbringing? That attitude will be harder and harder to defend, as more and more phenotypes enter your society. You may even find that your neighbor, who you've known your whole life, actually does not have any religion, or a different one, even though his ancestry goes back forever as natives of your geographical area, then you will no longer count him as your countryman? So by following this train of logic, and remembering at each point that there really is no such thing as a true Scotsman, the logical reduction of this is, that what makes someone a citizen of your country is entirely and only defined by whether or not they hold a passport from your country, or whatever national identity identifier your country has. Now, fast forward some generations of actually educating children, instead of indoctrinating them to think they're better or more right than others, but that people are people, and planet earth is home to people, and you end up with a society such as your current one (without the religion and racism), but one that entails the entire planet. Show me a country, any country, and I will show you country.numberOfCitizens indiduals who actually don't agree on as much as they fool themselves into believing that they do, and yet somehow manage to find some mutual respect and regard for oneanother. There's no good (future) reason to base that regard on citizenship rather than on being human.
- theandrewbailey 6y ago
  > Why can't your sense of place be the entire world? How is that not better? To be able to show an entire planet to your children and ttell them, this here, is your home world, these are your people ? That would mean that I'm equally at home in a crowded Asian city, an African village, or any small town in a flyover state as I am in a Western city. I'm not.
eeZah7Ux 6y ago
> national identity (language, ethnicity, food, architecture, history You are making a lot of confusion between different things. Culture, ethnicity and nationality are not the same thing. For example, you can go live in a different country and you will not magically forget your customs, language, favorite food when you cross the border. You can learn a second and third language and it will not affect your taste for architecture. It's shocking that we still have to explain such basic things. Next step: realize that any sharp distinction between culture, ethnicity and so on is based on a completely artificial "line in sand".
- davidivadavid 6y ago
  Fuzzy boundaries are still boundaries. Everything isn't a uniform blob. I don't understand how people can both glorify differences and pretend they don't exist.
  - eeZah7Ux 6y ago
    > Fuzzy boundaries are still boundaries. I wrote "sharp distinction". It's the opposite of fuzzy. > Everything isn't a uniform blob. I never said otherwise. > I don't understand how people can both glorify differences and pretend they don't exist. How is this a reply to my points? Who are you talking about?

dusted 6y ago

Why do you view only your country as your extended family? Are your countrymen somehow better than the rest of the people on the planet? Why can't your sense of place be the entire world? How is that not better? To be able to show an entire planet to your children and ttell them, this here, is your home world, these are your people ? A tribe of a million members? Please! A tribe can't be larger the amount of people who can know each other, everything beyond that is something else, it's civilization.

travelthrow4 6y ago
Because visually the people in my country look the same as me, we share a similar history for many thousands of years, we have mostly very similar world view, etc. A person from India for example is going to look different, have a different religion, different history, and different world view.
- dusted 6y ago
  Everyone looks visually different, and you will encounter, in your own country, a fellow countryman, or woman, whose parents are born in your country, who have the same nationality and legal status as yourself, but a different ancestry, maybe from India, that person will then, in your mind, not be your peer, simply because they look different? Even though you share culture and history and upbringing? That attitude will be harder and harder to defend, as more and more phenotypes enter your society. You may even find that your neighbor, who you've known your whole life, actually does not have any religion, or a different one, even though his ancestry goes back forever as natives of your geographical area, then you will no longer count him as your countryman? So by following this train of logic, and remembering at each point that there really is no such thing as a true Scotsman, the logical reduction of this is, that what makes someone a citizen of your country is entirely and only defined by whether or not they hold a passport from your country, or whatever national identity identifier your country has. Now, fast forward some generations of actually educating children, instead of indoctrinating them to think they're better or more right than others, but that people are people, and planet earth is home to people, and you end up with a society such as your current one (without the religion and racism), but one that entails the entire planet. Show me a country, any country, and I will show you country.numberOfCitizens indiduals who actually don't agree on as much as they fool themselves into believing that they do, and yet somehow manage to find some mutual respect and regard for oneanother. There's no good (future) reason to base that regard on citizenship rather than on being human.
theandrewbailey 6y ago
> Why can't your sense of place be the entire world? How is that not better? To be able to show an entire planet to your children and ttell them, this here, is your home world, these are your people ? That would mean that I'm equally at home in a crowded Asian city, an African village, or any small town in a flyover state as I am in a Western city. I'm not.

eeZah7Ux 6y ago

> national identity (language, ethnicity, food, architecture, history You are making a lot of confusion between different things. Culture, ethnicity and nationality are not the same thing. For example, you can go live in a different country and you will not magically forget your customs, language, favorite food when you cross the border. You can learn a second and third language and it will not affect your taste for architecture. It's shocking that we still have to explain such basic things. Next step: realize that any sharp distinction between culture, ethnicity and so on is based on a completely artificial "line in sand".

davidivadavid 6y ago
Fuzzy boundaries are still boundaries. Everything isn't a uniform blob. I don't understand how people can both glorify differences and pretend they don't exist.
- eeZah7Ux 6y ago
  > Fuzzy boundaries are still boundaries. I wrote "sharp distinction". It's the opposite of fuzzy. > Everything isn't a uniform blob. I never said otherwise. > I don't understand how people can both glorify differences and pretend they don't exist. How is this a reply to my points? Who are you talking about?