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It really depends on your tonality when you say it. In either case, saying "Are you sure increasing your user retention isn't worth something to you?" is just g

It really depends on your tonality when you say it. In either case, saying "Are you sure increasing your user retention isn't worth something to you?" is just going to be met with another "No, we don't need it" from the other end. "So you have perfect user retention then?" is a better question because you know for a fact that they can't have 100% user retention and they know that as well so it forces further dialogue.

jrochkind1 6y ago
i guess this is why I'm not a salesperson. If it works it works, but I'm having trouble accepting that it's not demeaning, which was the original contention. Because it's not really a question at all, it's a sarcastic question. Maybe being demeaning gets sales, sure.
- james1071 6y ago
  Agree with you on that.
- stevewodil 6y ago
  Think of it more as being a pattern interrupt. They are saying no to you over and over, so by asking the question, "So you have perfect user retention then?" they can either say "No" instinctively which opens your sales pitch because they've now told you they have a user retention problem, or they stop and think about the question in which case you've successfully interrupted the pattern of no's that preceded the question and can further the discussion. There are definitely better examples I could come up with, but now I'm stuck with this one because it's what I quickly typed out earlier.
- _carbyau_ 6y ago
  Sales - like marketing - definitely does have an element of psych to it. Anecdotally, it feels as though it leans on a lot on the targets level of politeness and decorum to want to continue the conversation. I favour polite but abrupt and seemingly heartless conversation enders for this reason. "Hello sir, would you like to help a child keep eating for $2 a month?" "No, thank you!" Back to this specific case, I guess the trick is to deliver your question almost rhetorically with both parties knowing that it leaves an answer that is common knowledge. Kinda like safe small talk about the weather. Keeps the conversation going buying time for another hook to be deployed.
- ZephyrBlu 6y ago
  > Because it's not really a question at all, it's a sarcastic question It's not sarcastic, it's serious and that's the point. Obviously they don't have 100% retention, so this question might open them up to talk about their retention instead of saying "no, it's fine like it is". It doesn't matter how good your retention currently is, if the product can boost it even by a couple of percent it would probably pay for itself many times over. I think you could make the argument that saying "no, we don't need it" before even trying to understand the value prop is just as demeaning.
- CRConrad 6y ago
  You seem to have an idiosyncratic definition of “demeaning”.

jrochkind1 6y ago

i guess this is why I'm not a salesperson. If it works it works, but I'm having trouble accepting that it's not demeaning, which was the original contention. Because it's not really a question at all, it's a sarcastic question. Maybe being demeaning gets sales, sure.

james1071 6y ago
Agree with you on that.
stevewodil 6y ago
Think of it more as being a pattern interrupt. They are saying no to you over and over, so by asking the question, "So you have perfect user retention then?" they can either say "No" instinctively which opens your sales pitch because they've now told you they have a user retention problem, or they stop and think about the question in which case you've successfully interrupted the pattern of no's that preceded the question and can further the discussion. There are definitely better examples I could come up with, but now I'm stuck with this one because it's what I quickly typed out earlier.
_carbyau_ 6y ago
Sales - like marketing - definitely does have an element of psych to it. Anecdotally, it feels as though it leans on a lot on the targets level of politeness and decorum to want to continue the conversation. I favour polite but abrupt and seemingly heartless conversation enders for this reason. "Hello sir, would you like to help a child keep eating for $2 a month?" "No, thank you!" Back to this specific case, I guess the trick is to deliver your question almost rhetorically with both parties knowing that it leaves an answer that is common knowledge. Kinda like safe small talk about the weather. Keeps the conversation going buying time for another hook to be deployed.
ZephyrBlu 6y ago
> Because it's not really a question at all, it's a sarcastic question It's not sarcastic, it's serious and that's the point. Obviously they don't have 100% retention, so this question might open them up to talk about their retention instead of saying "no, it's fine like it is". It doesn't matter how good your retention currently is, if the product can boost it even by a couple of percent it would probably pay for itself many times over. I think you could make the argument that saying "no, we don't need it" before even trying to understand the value prop is just as demeaning.
CRConrad 6y ago
You seem to have an idiosyncratic definition of “demeaning”.