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Yes I know about the Daily Mail's reputation, but the court documents are linked in the post. I don't have PACER access so I can't verify, but this is one that

by roel_v 6y ago

Yes I know about the Daily Mail's reputation, but the court documents are linked in the post. I don't have PACER access so I can't verify, but this is one that would be very easy to refute. Also, there are many other online sources reporting on this, and they have been for a long time (see e.g. https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/6999800-Jones-Stalking-Affidavit.html https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/6999800-Jones-Stalki... ) Is all of this relevant to the whistle blower case? Well, it might not be, but this sort of backstory does call up many questions. How did a person with a history of inappropriate sexual conduct with subordinates get a management position in the first place?

proverbialbunny 6y ago
>How did a person with a history of inappropriate sexual conduct with subordinates get a management position in the first place? If it happened it was a relationship between two consenting adults, so there is not really a reason for them to care.
- abduhl 6y ago
  There is a presumption that any relationship between a teacher and their student is non-consensual. This is memorialized in nearly every school’s code of conduct that I have ever seen. If it happened then it was sexual harassment at a minimum and most likely rape.
  - proverbialbunny 6y ago
    The article doesn't say she was a professor, so it's hard to say. It really is a garbage article. As far as I can tell everything in the article is hearsay, which doesn't help. Even the evidence is based off of hearsay. >any relationship between a teacher and their student is non-consensual That's because teachers teach students typically under the age of 18. Professors teach adults. She obviously wasn't a high school teacher. Some universities have no policy against professor student relationships, though in the last 10 years that has quickly been changing.
    - roel_v 6y ago
      Stop spreading misinformation. THE COURT CASE IS LINKED IN TFA, and I linked it again (from another source) above. The article does say that she was an instructor. Not a tenured professor but the person she had the relationship with was her student. All of this is described in the unhinged 300+ page document she wrote where she herself documented in cringy detail how their "relationship" unfolded (WHICH IS PART OF THE COURT CASE). Just because two people are adults doesn't make a relationship between them not dodgy; think about how bad it is for a doctor to date a patient. The situation here isn't quite as bad (well, if you start stalking a former student after they break up with you, I guess one could also argue that this case is much worse than some other situations where everything unfolds amicably), but still, relationships between people in power and those over whom the power is wielded are not just socially frowned upon, they are recognized as Bad News (if not always strictly illegal) for a long time now. I'm not sure why you're so insistent on defending if not a sexual predator then at least someone with highly questionable judgement. And again, maybe all of this has little to do with the whistleblower stuff, but there is no question about whether or not it's true that she had an inappropriate extramartial affair with a student, stalked him after he tried to end it and was fired over the whole ordeal.
      - proverbialbunny 6y ago
        An instructor is not a professor. When I was in junior high, high school, and at college, I taught a lecture or two regularly. I was no teacher or professor, but I was a lecturer / instructor, while I was going to school. It says nothing. >THE COURT CASE IS LINKED IN TFA If you look at the court case the only thing in it that is not hearsay is a dented bumper. Furthermore, she was dismissed. Because of a lack of evidence it never would have held a candle in court because it was all hearsay. This is the problem with articles like this. They defame people, and the average person who has no legal background eats it up as the wholesale truth. >I'm not sure why you're so insistent on defending if not a sexual predator then at least someone with highly questionable judgement. Woo.. there is nothing in there that says she is a sexual predator. >And again, maybe all of this has little to do with the whistleblower stuff, but there is no question about whether or not it's true that she had an inappropriate extramartial affair with a student, stalked him after he tried to end it and was fired over the whole ordeal. It has nothing to do with the whistleblower stuff. It has to do with how garbage the article is. Falling for it is embarrassing. The fact that articles like these today are legal, is a sad state of affairs. In the US up until the 80s, articles like these would be against the law for hopefully obvious reason.

by roel_v 6y ago

proverbialbunny 6y ago

>How did a person with a history of inappropriate sexual conduct with subordinates get a management position in the first place? If it happened it was a relationship between two consenting adults, so there is not really a reason for them to care.

abduhl 6y ago
There is a presumption that any relationship between a teacher and their student is non-consensual. This is memorialized in nearly every school’s code of conduct that I have ever seen. If it happened then it was sexual harassment at a minimum and most likely rape.
- proverbialbunny 6y ago
  The article doesn't say she was a professor, so it's hard to say. It really is a garbage article. As far as I can tell everything in the article is hearsay, which doesn't help. Even the evidence is based off of hearsay. >any relationship between a teacher and their student is non-consensual That's because teachers teach students typically under the age of 18. Professors teach adults. She obviously wasn't a high school teacher. Some universities have no policy against professor student relationships, though in the last 10 years that has quickly been changing.
  - roel_v 6y ago
    Stop spreading misinformation. THE COURT CASE IS LINKED IN TFA, and I linked it again (from another source) above. The article does say that she was an instructor. Not a tenured professor but the person she had the relationship with was her student. All of this is described in the unhinged 300+ page document she wrote where she herself documented in cringy detail how their "relationship" unfolded (WHICH IS PART OF THE COURT CASE). Just because two people are adults doesn't make a relationship between them not dodgy; think about how bad it is for a doctor to date a patient. The situation here isn't quite as bad (well, if you start stalking a former student after they break up with you, I guess one could also argue that this case is much worse than some other situations where everything unfolds amicably), but still, relationships between people in power and those over whom the power is wielded are not just socially frowned upon, they are recognized as Bad News (if not always strictly illegal) for a long time now. I'm not sure why you're so insistent on defending if not a sexual predator then at least someone with highly questionable judgement. And again, maybe all of this has little to do with the whistleblower stuff, but there is no question about whether or not it's true that she had an inappropriate extramartial affair with a student, stalked him after he tried to end it and was fired over the whole ordeal.
    - proverbialbunny 6y ago
      An instructor is not a professor. When I was in junior high, high school, and at college, I taught a lecture or two regularly. I was no teacher or professor, but I was a lecturer / instructor, while I was going to school. It says nothing. >THE COURT CASE IS LINKED IN TFA If you look at the court case the only thing in it that is not hearsay is a dented bumper. Furthermore, she was dismissed. Because of a lack of evidence it never would have held a candle in court because it was all hearsay. This is the problem with articles like this. They defame people, and the average person who has no legal background eats it up as the wholesale truth. >I'm not sure why you're so insistent on defending if not a sexual predator then at least someone with highly questionable judgement. Woo.. there is nothing in there that says she is a sexual predator. >And again, maybe all of this has little to do with the whistleblower stuff, but there is no question about whether or not it's true that she had an inappropriate extramartial affair with a student, stalked him after he tried to end it and was fired over the whole ordeal. It has nothing to do with the whistleblower stuff. It has to do with how garbage the article is. Falling for it is embarrassing. The fact that articles like these today are legal, is a sad state of affairs. In the US up until the 80s, articles like these would be against the law for hopefully obvious reason.