6 ms·

The only innovation zynga did was changing the logos of other games (Farmville=Farm town, mafia wars=mobwars, cafe world=restaurant city, it's as if there's mas

The only innovation zynga did was changing the logos of other games (Farmville=Farm town, mafia wars=mobwars, cafe world=restaurant city, it's as if there's mass brain damage in that company and they can't come up with a single original idea). They are also among the most aggressive game euthanizers: they have shut down all their games that did not generate tons of cash, much to the chagrin of their players. Let's not forget they have an exclusive agreement with facebook, the terms of which we don't know; not a very fair advantage. Also, zynga and old gaming houses have different audiences, so i 'm not sure they're killing anyone

ansy 15y ago
I think what you're saying is that Zynga is so good at business it succeeds fantastically despite its products. That translates to a great company in Wall Street terms. Look at McDonalds. McDonalds certainly didn't invent the hamburger. McDonalds probably never made the best hamburger. But it sure as hell found a way to make money off hamburgers like nobody before. Those other companies, those are the less capable small fries with handfuls of loyal customers while Zynga is busy expanding its empire to every street corner.
- TillE 15y ago
  That's a good analogy. But McDonald's has a couple of huge advantages that Zynga doesn't. The first is physical space - they are omnipresent. On the internet, everyone can be everywhere. The second is branding. People know FarmVille. Do they know Zynga? Probably not. In Zynga's market, anyone could release a great game and have a massive success with little investment. McDonald's has serious momentum; it's utterly impossible to imagine a scenario where a competitor shows up and quickly puts them out of business. Same thing applies to Facebook. Does it apply to FarmVille? Again, I'd say no. If you see this type of game as a fad, or a mere precursor to much better games that will be offered for the same price (free), Zynga's position is quite precarious.
  - Klonoar 15y ago
    The fact that people know Farmville, but not Zynga, doesn't actually mean much. Zynga has been able to shuttle players on to new games and releases very successfully just from advertisements in their then-current swath of properties. You could play their games and probably never give two shits about the company behind it.
    - hugh3 15y ago
      Yeah, but how long can they really keep that up? You can shuffle people from Sim-farm to Sim-town to Sim-restaurant to Sim-space-station to Sim-mafia to Sim-factory-that-makes-little-models-of-factories but someday they're gonna stop paying attention. Games come and go, game genres come and go on a somewhat longer but still finite timescale.
      - Klonoar 15y ago
        I'm not debating you on that, since I agree with you. I simply wanted to point out the issue with your point about people not knowing Zynga and that possibly being an issue for them (i.e, it's by and large not). Even if people knew Zynga I get the sense it wouldn't make a huge difference; their games aren't quite immersive enough to inspire the type of brand loyalty you'd see with Nintendo/Blizzard/etc.
- ignifero 15y ago
  I hate analogies, but i have to note that McDonalds invented the fastfood business. Zynga has shown inability to demonstrate innovation and acts opportunistically. If they shut down today, they 'd be instantly replaced by other existing social games. "A business that makes nothing but money is a poor business". That's just the view i have of them. It would be nice if we could have the opinions of a Zynga employee.
  - nikcub 15y ago
    > McDonalds invented the fastfood business. It can be argued that Zynga invented the new freemium and social gaming model - ie. pay for the entertainment you get. They also pioneered a lot of the marketing and the in-game viral aspects. This is why they can release average or even clone games and still find hits - in the same way McDonalds can release a bad burger but because of their model still be a success.
    - ignifero 15y ago
      No, no and no. Games like mob wars, farm town etc had these features already. If they pioneered something, it's "pushing facebook's communication channels to their limits"; I honestly cannot remember anything else.
      - ansy 15y ago
        To be fair with the analogy, McDonalds did not invent fast food. Drive ins and walk up fast food burger joints were everywhere before McDonalds started. McDonalds just took efficiency to a whole new level. It used processes that pushed modern cooking equipment to its limits and invented a few new tools to fill the gaps. One store could serve and reach so many more customers every day for so much less than the competition. Combine that with repeatable best practices and an expansionist vision and you've got an empire. By the same analogy, Zynga took that same social game model and jacked up conversion rates to the max. It pushed social networks to the limits and invented new tools to fill the gaps. It got more money from each user and had more users than anyone else. It took this formula and repeated it again and again with an expansionist vision. Mob wars, farm town, etc looked the part, but the way those businesses operate isn't in the same league. Talk about physical presence, Zynga has multi-millions of users in 100% Zynga owned virtual real estate every day. All it needs to do is mention a new game to its millions of users and that game has an instant million user base. For a no-name competitor to do the same would require millions in marketing or a miracle.
jcampbell1 15y ago
World of Warcraft is an Everquest knockoff. From an investment perspective, I am mixed about whether Zynga's lack of originality is a positive or a negative.
- puredemo 15y ago
  "It's not who does it first, it's who does it second."

ansy 15y ago

I think what you're saying is that Zynga is so good at business it succeeds fantastically despite its products. That translates to a great company in Wall Street terms. Look at McDonalds. McDonalds certainly didn't invent the hamburger. McDonalds probably never made the best hamburger. But it sure as hell found a way to make money off hamburgers like nobody before. Those other companies, those are the less capable small fries with handfuls of loyal customers while Zynga is busy expanding its empire to every street corner.

TillE 15y ago
That's a good analogy. But McDonald's has a couple of huge advantages that Zynga doesn't. The first is physical space - they are omnipresent. On the internet, everyone can be everywhere. The second is branding. People know FarmVille. Do they know Zynga? Probably not. In Zynga's market, anyone could release a great game and have a massive success with little investment. McDonald's has serious momentum; it's utterly impossible to imagine a scenario where a competitor shows up and quickly puts them out of business. Same thing applies to Facebook. Does it apply to FarmVille? Again, I'd say no. If you see this type of game as a fad, or a mere precursor to much better games that will be offered for the same price (free), Zynga's position is quite precarious.
- Klonoar 15y ago
  The fact that people know Farmville, but not Zynga, doesn't actually mean much. Zynga has been able to shuttle players on to new games and releases very successfully just from advertisements in their then-current swath of properties. You could play their games and probably never give two shits about the company behind it.
  - hugh3 15y ago
    Yeah, but how long can they really keep that up? You can shuffle people from Sim-farm to Sim-town to Sim-restaurant to Sim-space-station to Sim-mafia to Sim-factory-that-makes-little-models-of-factories but someday they're gonna stop paying attention. Games come and go, game genres come and go on a somewhat longer but still finite timescale.
    - Klonoar 15y ago
      I'm not debating you on that, since I agree with you. I simply wanted to point out the issue with your point about people not knowing Zynga and that possibly being an issue for them (i.e, it's by and large not). Even if people knew Zynga I get the sense it wouldn't make a huge difference; their games aren't quite immersive enough to inspire the type of brand loyalty you'd see with Nintendo/Blizzard/etc.
ignifero 15y ago
I hate analogies, but i have to note that McDonalds invented the fastfood business. Zynga has shown inability to demonstrate innovation and acts opportunistically. If they shut down today, they 'd be instantly replaced by other existing social games. "A business that makes nothing but money is a poor business". That's just the view i have of them. It would be nice if we could have the opinions of a Zynga employee.
- nikcub 15y ago
  > McDonalds invented the fastfood business. It can be argued that Zynga invented the new freemium and social gaming model - ie. pay for the entertainment you get. They also pioneered a lot of the marketing and the in-game viral aspects. This is why they can release average or even clone games and still find hits - in the same way McDonalds can release a bad burger but because of their model still be a success.
  - ignifero 15y ago
    No, no and no. Games like mob wars, farm town etc had these features already. If they pioneered something, it's "pushing facebook's communication channels to their limits"; I honestly cannot remember anything else.
    - ansy 15y ago
      To be fair with the analogy, McDonalds did not invent fast food. Drive ins and walk up fast food burger joints were everywhere before McDonalds started. McDonalds just took efficiency to a whole new level. It used processes that pushed modern cooking equipment to its limits and invented a few new tools to fill the gaps. One store could serve and reach so many more customers every day for so much less than the competition. Combine that with repeatable best practices and an expansionist vision and you've got an empire. By the same analogy, Zynga took that same social game model and jacked up conversion rates to the max. It pushed social networks to the limits and invented new tools to fill the gaps. It got more money from each user and had more users than anyone else. It took this formula and repeated it again and again with an expansionist vision. Mob wars, farm town, etc looked the part, but the way those businesses operate isn't in the same league. Talk about physical presence, Zynga has multi-millions of users in 100% Zynga owned virtual real estate every day. All it needs to do is mention a new game to its millions of users and that game has an instant million user base. For a no-name competitor to do the same would require millions in marketing or a miracle.

jcampbell1 15y ago

World of Warcraft is an Everquest knockoff. From an investment perspective, I am mixed about whether Zynga's lack of originality is a positive or a negative.

puredemo 15y ago
"It's not who does it first, it's who does it second."