4 ms·

I think Google is overestimating its value. If Australia no longer has access to Google, they'll just find alternatives, and then discover that they never neede

I think Google is overestimating its value. If Australia no longer has access to Google, they'll just find alternatives, and then discover that they never needed Google after all.

visarga 6y ago
Nobody said "Australia no longer has access to Google". Google could simply skip Australian news in search results - deplatforming only the news, maybe later reopen access under a new agreement with the willing newspapers. But that could backfire and Google's power to deplatform a company or a whole market without recourse could be bad for their anti-trust lawsuits. They are benefiting from their powerful status of being a central internet infrastructure without wanting to be subjected to the rigors we set for other infrastructure, such as buildings, roads, energy and food. Would you agree to have the hypothetical 90% monopolist in road construction and operation ban your business or town, so you can eat your freedom and drive on unpaved roads?
- creata 6y ago
  > Nobody said "Australia no longer has access to Google" That's not true: the article's title intentionally misled on that front, and the article body continued to raise fears about a "restricted" search product.
dageshi 6y ago
Whatever search engine receives the majority of the traffic that google loses presumably then faces the same problem under the law?
- squiggleblaz 6y ago
  Well, they'd have to have some significant Australian nexus; Duck Duck Go is probably relatively safe from this but Bing would obviously be at risk. I suspect there would be some tendency to prefer the browser that is immune if this code is as unpopular as I imagine it will be.
kleiba 6y ago
Which alternative do you suggest?
- bovermyer 6y ago
  My original comment was not meant to suggest an alternative, just to make an observation. However, I exclusively use DuckDuckGo, personally.
avsteele 6y ago
I don' understand this point. Have any other search engines agreed to this pay-for-news-clicks scheme? Whoever is popular next will face the same pressure.
PeterisP 6y ago
I think the Australian news media are overestimating their value. If Google no longer links to Australian news media, IMHO the Australian users won't bother to find alternatives, they'll simply read less Australian news as they will see them only when explicitly going to their sites. I'm sure that USA and UK news media will work well enough for most searches and they will be happy to serve Australian users and earn money off of them by showing (Google-provided) Australia-targeted ads.
- hairofadog 6y ago
  Is Google search how most people find their news? I’m not a typical user, so I really don’t know, but my sense is that people have a go-to source (Reddit, Twitter, Facebook, aggregators like Apple News or yeah, Google News, or loading sites directly like NYT, Fox News, etc.) If they do use Google search, what are they searching for? Do they type “news”, or do they think, hmm, what topics am I interested in today, and search for those directly?
  - PeterisP 6y ago
    It's a substantial percentage of news site traffic - if you're interested in something in particular (as opposed to "what's new today") often people'll search for some topic (e.g. "impeachment" or "Arsenal game" or the name of some celebrity) and get linked to an article in a news site, so a significant percentage of news site traffic does come from search engine. On the other hand, you're right that intuitively people probably won't consider that their local news sites must be accessible through google, if they want news, they do have a go-to source, whatever that is - so that supports an argument that Australian news sites overestimate their importance to Google; Google probably won't suffer much if it can't or won't link to them.
- Mayzie 6y ago
  > I'm sure that USA and UK news media will work well enough for most searches and they will be happy to serve Australian users and earn money off of them by showing (Google-provided) Australia-targeted ads. The law proposed is either a) pay existing media establishments to link to their content, or b) do not show any news at all, including from international sources. They won't be able to block local news and show international sources without facing penalties.

I think Google is overestimating its value. If Australia no longer has access to Google, they'll just find alternatives, and then discover that they never needed Google after all.

visarga 6y ago

Nobody said "Australia no longer has access to Google". Google could simply skip Australian news in search results - deplatforming only the news, maybe later reopen access under a new agreement with the willing newspapers. But that could backfire and Google's power to deplatform a company or a whole market without recourse could be bad for their anti-trust lawsuits. They are benefiting from their powerful status of being a central internet infrastructure without wanting to be subjected to the rigors we set for other infrastructure, such as buildings, roads, energy and food. Would you agree to have the hypothetical 90% monopolist in road construction and operation ban your business or town, so you can eat your freedom and drive on unpaved roads?

creata 6y ago
> Nobody said "Australia no longer has access to Google" That's not true: the article's title intentionally misled on that front, and the article body continued to raise fears about a "restricted" search product.

dageshi 6y ago

Whatever search engine receives the majority of the traffic that google loses presumably then faces the same problem under the law?

squiggleblaz 6y ago
Well, they'd have to have some significant Australian nexus; Duck Duck Go is probably relatively safe from this but Bing would obviously be at risk. I suspect there would be some tendency to prefer the browser that is immune if this code is as unpopular as I imagine it will be.

kleiba 6y ago

Which alternative do you suggest?

bovermyer 6y ago
My original comment was not meant to suggest an alternative, just to make an observation. However, I exclusively use DuckDuckGo, personally.

avsteele 6y ago

I don' understand this point. Have any other search engines agreed to this pay-for-news-clicks scheme? Whoever is popular next will face the same pressure.

PeterisP 6y ago

I think the Australian news media are overestimating their value. If Google no longer links to Australian news media, IMHO the Australian users won't bother to find alternatives, they'll simply read less Australian news as they will see them only when explicitly going to their sites. I'm sure that USA and UK news media will work well enough for most searches and they will be happy to serve Australian users and earn money off of them by showing (Google-provided) Australia-targeted ads.

hairofadog 6y ago
Is Google search how most people find their news? I’m not a typical user, so I really don’t know, but my sense is that people have a go-to source (Reddit, Twitter, Facebook, aggregators like Apple News or yeah, Google News, or loading sites directly like NYT, Fox News, etc.) If they do use Google search, what are they searching for? Do they type “news”, or do they think, hmm, what topics am I interested in today, and search for those directly?
- PeterisP 6y ago
  It's a substantial percentage of news site traffic - if you're interested in something in particular (as opposed to "what's new today") often people'll search for some topic (e.g. "impeachment" or "Arsenal game" or the name of some celebrity) and get linked to an article in a news site, so a significant percentage of news site traffic does come from search engine. On the other hand, you're right that intuitively people probably won't consider that their local news sites must be accessible through google, if they want news, they do have a go-to source, whatever that is - so that supports an argument that Australian news sites overestimate their importance to Google; Google probably won't suffer much if it can't or won't link to them.
Mayzie 6y ago
> I'm sure that USA and UK news media will work well enough for most searches and they will be happy to serve Australian users and earn money off of them by showing (Google-provided) Australia-targeted ads. The law proposed is either a) pay existing media establishments to link to their content, or b) do not show any news at all, including from international sources. They won't be able to block local news and show international sources without facing penalties.