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Fantastic work by the Wine team! Congrats on the release. Still very disappointed that macOS has not been supported since Catalina (10.15) dropped 32-bit suppo

Fantastic work by the Wine team! Congrats on the release. Still very disappointed that macOS has not been supported since Catalina (10.15) dropped 32-bit support - from my understanding, the 32-bit architecture is deeply integrated into Wine and removing it would be a significant effort. Understandably the focus has always been on Linux, but I would still appreciate at least an update from the team on potential macOS support in the future.

shmerl 6y ago
I think focus on Linux is also reasonable because Apple refuse to support Vulkan. I don't think Wine developers should waste their time adding Metal support in addition. Wine developers said in the past, that they were considering dropping macOS support altogether because of issues like that.
- AgentEpsilon 6y ago
  I agree, I don't think it would be productive for the Wine team to support Metal. I do wonder how feasible it would be for MoltenVK [0] to be supported instead. [0]: https://moltengl.com/moltenvk/ https://moltengl.com/moltenvk/
  - mrpippy 6y ago
    Wine on macOS can already use MoltenVK to expose Vulkan to Windows apps, CrossOver uses this with DXVK to support D3D11 games.
    - shmerl 6y ago
      Double translation especially on a lower end hardware doesn't make it a good experience I bet. Linux is a much better option for gaming.
      - terramex 6y ago
        It is surprisingly solid, I have tested multiple Windows games on M1 MacBook Air through Crossover and the only one that had issues was Outer Wilds - its engine (Unity) uses geometry shaders for GPU skinning and Metal has no support for those. They could be emulated using compute shaders, but MoltenVK does not do this at the moment. Animations work properly inside Windows VM through Parallels, so I guess this is what their proprietary driver does. Apart from that I played Witcher 3, Sekiro and Dark Souls through CrossOver with no issues and very solid performance on basically the weakest ARM Mac that will ever exist. But I of course agree that Linux is much better option for gaming.
        wwright 6y ago
        > I have tested multiple Windows games on M1 MacBook Air through Crossover So you had x64 binaries calling a DX API that called a Vulkan API that called a Metal API all on top of a JIT translation layer to ARM on two month old hardware and it worked well? That’s fucking incredible, man.
        spijdar 6y ago
        I don't have a mac anymore, but a few months back I was using crossover on catalina, and can confirm that the DX11 translation works well. I can believe that even on Rosetta it'd still work surprisingly well.
        hokumguru 6y ago
        Quinn from snazzy labs got the Witcher 3 running on an m1 MacBook Air at a blazing 40fps! Absolute insanity how well tooling has evolved.
        shmerl 6y ago
        On what settings?
        shmerl 6y ago
        Sounds interesting. So besides translating calls it also emulates the CPU? How does it run x86_64 games like The Witcher 3 on ARM?
garaetjjte 6y ago
It seems this is supported in CrossOver: https://www.codeweavers.com/blog/jwhite/2019/12/10/celebrating-the-difficult-the-release-of-crossover-19 https://www.codeweavers.com/blog/jwhite/2019/12/10/celebrati... And it seems possible to build CrossOver wine from sources: https://github.com/Gcenx/homebrew-wine https://github.com/Gcenx/homebrew-wine
- _coveredInBees 6y ago
  Thanks! This worked like a charm for me.
0x0 6y ago
CrossOver seems to have support for 32bit on Catalina through some sort of major effort. Not sure if this will trickle over to open source wine anytime soon? https://www.codeweavers.com/blog/jwhite/2019/12/10/celebrating-the-difficult-the-release-of-crossover-19 https://www.codeweavers.com/blog/jwhite/2019/12/10/celebrati...
- BugsJustFindMe 6y ago
  CrossOver is open source. PlayOnMac uses their variant.
- nuker 6y ago
  a humble ask for eGPU support
mrpippy 6y ago
A 64-bit-only Wine builds and works normally on Catalina and Big Sur. 32-bit support exists in CrossOver’s wine but is too much of a messy hack to merge upstream. There’s hope that an upstreamable solution will be found in the future though.
muizelaar 6y ago
It seems like the work to move the core modules to PE format that happened in 6.0 is work that can help bring back 32-bit support on Mac. See https://www.winehq.org/pipermail/wine-devel/2019-December/157182.html https://www.winehq.org/pipermail/wine-devel/2019-December/15...
bdefore 6y ago
Some related news in the release notes: "This release is dedicated to the memory of Ken Thomases, who passed away just before Christmas at the age of 51. Ken was an incredibly brilliant developer, and the mastermind behind the macOS support in Wine. We all miss his skills, his patience, and his dark sense of humor."
- coding123 6y ago
  More about Ken https://www.startribune.com/obituaries/detail/0000379516/ https://www.startribune.com/obituaries/detail/0000379516/

shmerl 6y ago

I think focus on Linux is also reasonable because Apple refuse to support Vulkan. I don't think Wine developers should waste their time adding Metal support in addition. Wine developers said in the past, that they were considering dropping macOS support altogether because of issues like that.

AgentEpsilon 6y ago
I agree, I don't think it would be productive for the Wine team to support Metal. I do wonder how feasible it would be for MoltenVK [0] to be supported instead. [0]: https://moltengl.com/moltenvk/ https://moltengl.com/moltenvk/
- mrpippy 6y ago
  Wine on macOS can already use MoltenVK to expose Vulkan to Windows apps, CrossOver uses this with DXVK to support D3D11 games.
  - shmerl 6y ago
    Double translation especially on a lower end hardware doesn't make it a good experience I bet. Linux is a much better option for gaming.
    - terramex 6y ago
      It is surprisingly solid, I have tested multiple Windows games on M1 MacBook Air through Crossover and the only one that had issues was Outer Wilds - its engine (Unity) uses geometry shaders for GPU skinning and Metal has no support for those. They could be emulated using compute shaders, but MoltenVK does not do this at the moment. Animations work properly inside Windows VM through Parallels, so I guess this is what their proprietary driver does. Apart from that I played Witcher 3, Sekiro and Dark Souls through CrossOver with no issues and very solid performance on basically the weakest ARM Mac that will ever exist. But I of course agree that Linux is much better option for gaming.
      - wwright 6y ago
        > I have tested multiple Windows games on M1 MacBook Air through Crossover So you had x64 binaries calling a DX API that called a Vulkan API that called a Metal API all on top of a JIT translation layer to ARM on two month old hardware and it worked well? That’s fucking incredible, man.
        spijdar 6y ago
        I don't have a mac anymore, but a few months back I was using crossover on catalina, and can confirm that the DX11 translation works well. I can believe that even on Rosetta it'd still work surprisingly well.
        hokumguru 6y ago
        Quinn from snazzy labs got the Witcher 3 running on an m1 MacBook Air at a blazing 40fps! Absolute insanity how well tooling has evolved.
        shmerl 6y ago
        On what settings?
      - shmerl 6y ago
        Sounds interesting. So besides translating calls it also emulates the CPU? How does it run x86_64 games like The Witcher 3 on ARM?

garaetjjte 6y ago

It seems this is supported in CrossOver: https://www.codeweavers.com/blog/jwhite/2019/12/10/celebrating-the-difficult-the-release-of-crossover-19 https://www.codeweavers.com/blog/jwhite/2019/12/10/celebrati... And it seems possible to build CrossOver wine from sources: https://github.com/Gcenx/homebrew-wine https://github.com/Gcenx/homebrew-wine

_coveredInBees 6y ago
Thanks! This worked like a charm for me.

0x0 6y ago

CrossOver seems to have support for 32bit on Catalina through some sort of major effort. Not sure if this will trickle over to open source wine anytime soon? https://www.codeweavers.com/blog/jwhite/2019/12/10/celebrating-the-difficult-the-release-of-crossover-19 https://www.codeweavers.com/blog/jwhite/2019/12/10/celebrati...

BugsJustFindMe 6y ago
CrossOver is open source. PlayOnMac uses their variant.
nuker 6y ago
a humble ask for eGPU support

mrpippy 6y ago

A 64-bit-only Wine builds and works normally on Catalina and Big Sur. 32-bit support exists in CrossOver’s wine but is too much of a messy hack to merge upstream. There’s hope that an upstreamable solution will be found in the future though.

muizelaar 6y ago

It seems like the work to move the core modules to PE format that happened in 6.0 is work that can help bring back 32-bit support on Mac. See https://www.winehq.org/pipermail/wine-devel/2019-December/157182.html https://www.winehq.org/pipermail/wine-devel/2019-December/15...

bdefore 6y ago

Some related news in the release notes: "This release is dedicated to the memory of Ken Thomases, who passed away just before Christmas at the age of 51. Ken was an incredibly brilliant developer, and the mastermind behind the macOS support in Wine. We all miss his skills, his patience, and his dark sense of humor."

coding123 6y ago
More about Ken https://www.startribune.com/obituaries/detail/0000379516/ https://www.startribune.com/obituaries/detail/0000379516/