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I scored straight A's in french back in school. Then I went to work in France, expecting little issues with understanding the locals. Turns out understanding a

I scored straight A's in french back in school. Then I went to work in France, expecting little issues with understanding the locals. Turns out understanding a heavy Auvergnat accent is... difficult! I wrestled with the accent a couple of weeks, but after a while it 'clicked'. This was pretty much a matter of 'waking up and not having to translate it in your mind', a very strange sensation. I learned to distinct several accents: Parisian and Marseillais are different beasts, and Swiss-french is also different (I totally dig their counting system though, septante, huitante et nonante makes so much more sense). Also, I learned that the french in school is nothing like the french they speak in France. Sure, you get by and they'll understand you, but french relies heavy on vernacular, sayings and expressions. Nowadays people think I'm a Walloon (French-speaking from Belgium, while I'm Dutch), which is a great compliment to me!

brnt 6y ago
What's interesting and weird to me: both Dutch and French speakers from Belgium (so, Flemish and Walloon people) often sound like they have the same accent when speaking English! To me at least. Anybody else noticed this?
- dep_b 6y ago
  French R and soft G are shared among other things between the French and people from the South of Holland and below.
- roelschroeven 6y ago
  And Flemish people have a totally different accent when speaking English than Dutch people. TO my ears most Dutch people have a distinct English accent; some more than others, but almost always identifiable as from Dutch origin. Walter Lewin (as in e.g. https://youtu.be/sJG-rXBbmCc https://youtu.be/sJG-rXBbmCc) is a quite extreme example, despite the fact that he has lived in the US since 1966. Carice van Houten (Melisandre in Game of Thrones) has it too but less pronounced. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that Flemish people have a distinct English accent too, and that I simply don't notice it as much (being Flemish myself). Germans speaking English are often recognizable as well.
  - JW_00000 6y ago
    > I wouldn't be surprised to learn that Flemish people have a distinct English accent too Yes! One thing I sometimes notice is that, in Flemish we pronounce "wat is" as "wadis", and sometimes Flemish people in English will also say "Whad is". So Flemish people end up saying "Whad is dat?" instead of "What is that?". (Also lots of "eh?"s and the occasional "allez" pop up.)
- JW_00000 6y ago
  As a Flemish person, I wouldn't say Flemish and Walloon have the same accent in English, but I guess I'm not the one to judge. What is funny though, is that _in English_, you can sometimes detect different Flemish accents, i.e. when someone is speaking in English, I can tell whether they're from West-Flanders, from Antwerp, or from Limburg (in the east of Flanders). Their typical Flemish accent seeps through in their English. Also, the Dutch have the same accent in English as they do in Dutch (compared to the Flemish variant of Dutch).
- ilamont 6y ago
  Godfather was Walloon, ex-roommate was Flemish. Very different accents when speaking English - my godfather sounded like a French person, the Flemish roommate could be mistaken for a Scandinavian ... also notable that he sounded nothing like a Dutch person, who in my experience have very good British or North American "clean" accents.
mistahenry 6y ago
I'm an American living in Germany and I'm always thrilled when Germans think I'm Dutch after hearing my German ;) As for the accents, I had a similar experience when moving around from Berlin to Munich to Mainz with regard to the "clicking". It's like my brain suddenly recalibrated to understand the vowel and consonant changes in the accent (and particularly in certain areas the parts of the words that simply were dropped off the beginning/end of the word). People often tell me "Wow, I wish I was good at languages like you" and I honestly want them to understand how I feel: I didn't learn German, I simply spent enough time in the language for my brain to catch up and learn it for me.
- dep_b 6y ago
  Because you sound like the guy who dubbed Goldeneye to them! (JK ;) )
antb123 6y ago
Canadian (anglo) here that went to French immersion (teachers were mostly from France). I don't really have an accent which sucks. People just think I am a stupid French person who makes grammatical mistakes here and there and has a more limited vocabulary set. I am jealous of my American friends who speak with heavy accents and receive praise about their mastery.
- ftio 6y ago
  In this boat with my Italian. Northerners think I'm from the South. Southerners think I'm from Rome. Imagine their surprise when I tell them I'm from another Italy... Staten Italy.
  - GEBBL 6y ago
    Is that in staten island?
    - ftio 6y ago
      Staten Island == Staten Italy Staten Island has a very large population of Italian-Americans. Italian-American culture pervades many facets of Staten Island life and culture, even among non-Italians — so much so that many residents (and former residents like me) sometimes jokingly refer to it as Staten Italy.
  - davidw 6y ago
    Hah, I had this happen when doing some work in Rome. The CEO of the startup remarked that I had a heavy American accent, which... I was a bit taken aback by, because I rarely hear that, and I work hard to speak Italian well. Later, he heard me speaking with another guy at the company who was from near where I lived in Padova, and it dawned on him (I don't think he was the sharpest tool in the shed) that my accent was more 'Veneto' than American.
- jedimastert 6y ago
  > I don't really have an accent which sucks. People just think I am a stupid French person who makes grammatical mistakes here and there and has a more limited vocabulary set. I recently stumbled across a French/English comedy special which has a bit specifically about this, and how much French people judge other French people's French. I have absolutely zero experience with French and I still found most of the clips entertaining https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FIqVY1SwXls https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FIqVY1SwXls
idoubtit 6y ago
> french relies heavy on vernacular, sayings and expressions. It's more than that. There's a growing divergence between the spoken French and the written French. Où irions-nous ? Nous hésitâmes... (written French) On allait où ? On a hésité... (spoken French) Writings from the XVIIth century bare little difference to most modern novels. Of course, some words have evolved (e.g. "caresser" was akin to "praise", now it's more like "pet" or "fondle") but the grammar and the vocabulary is mostly identical. Centuries ago, the langage spoken was already different from what was written. I think the main difference was that there were many local variations, like shown in the Littré dictionary (1870s). The uniformization came with WWI, then the modern communication.
- dirktheman 6y ago
  Yes, they don't teach you the "on a...", "faire le truc avec...", "ouais" and "ca marche" at school, altough everyone uses this. I just wish schools would prepare you a little better for the difference between writing and speaking. My daughter learned to say "chouette, c'est jolie!" in her french class, which is preposterous and almost akin to saying 'Jolly gay, old chap!' in English today.
  - pmezard 6y ago
    > My daughter learned to say "chouette, c'est joli !" in her french class, which is preposterous and almost akin to saying 'Jolly gay, old chap!' in English today. Don't be so harsh. I would not be surprised to hear a child (~6/8 years old) say that, assuming some kind of polite/policed family background. > Yes, they don't teach you the "on a...", "faire le truc avec...", "ouais" and "ca marche" Imagine us watching Stringer Bell from "The Wire" for the first time. Or listening to pop or rap. Or chatting with native speakers. We just have more exposure.
    - lqet 6y ago
      > Imagine us watching Stringer Bell from "The Wire" for the first time. I tried to watch "The Wire" without English subtitles 10 years ago. No chance. I could barely make out individual words. After a season with subtitles, it just clicked.
martincmartin 6y ago
Have you ever gone to Quebec, or heard that accent?
- dirktheman 6y ago
  Never been there, but I met a french-speaking couple from Montreal once. I could understand them just fine, but couldn't place the accent. It didn't really occur to me hearing white people speaking french were from another country than France. (My former neighbour was from Congo and I was able to converse with him in french although his patois was hard to follow).
  - younohoo 6y ago
    It is said that the Quebec French accent is the same as was spoken in France in the 1600’s and hasn’t changed that much over the years whereas the French accent, has. I’m not sure if this is true, however.
    - kergonath 6y ago
      I think it’s a case of divergent evolution. We notice archaic phrases because they are funny, but québécois French also evolves.
    - Bayart 6y ago
      That's bad popular linguistics. Québec French has kept features that are archaic by Mainland French standards (the most blatant being the unfinished separation of oi and ai, which was solidified around the French Revolution), but it also has its own innovated features. You've got the same thing going on with American accents, and some of them keeping older English features. Simon Roper made a nice video about that [1]. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4rb0HPDnc8Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4rb0HPDnc8Y
misiti3780 6y ago
Not sure if you are a wine drinker, but the natural wines coming out of Auvergne are absolutely delicious! Some of the most interesting wines in the world IMO.
hobby-coder-guy 6y ago
Ninety-nine makes a lot more sense than four-twenty-ten-nine.
geebee 6y ago
I often watch French language tv shows or movies to keep up my language skills. I recently watched "Call my agent." Way better than "Versailles" ;) Thing is, it's very difficult for me to understand. But I realized that if I put on CC in French, I can understand it no problem, almost as well as if the CC was in English. But without the CC, I can't understand it well enough to enjoy the show. This leads me to believe that my difficulty in understanding spoken vs written French might not be so much grammar and vocab of spoken French, but rather the difficulty of translating sounds to words in real time. I really should leave the CC off entirely, but I want to enjoy the show, so for now, my compromise is to watch with CC in French. I am almost certainly compromising my language skills this way, though.
- robotmay 6y ago
  I asked some French friends if there was any good French TV that I could watch to learn more, but also enjoy at the same time. They started talking amongst themselves and I honestly thought they hadn't heard me, until about 5 minutes later they turned back and just said: "Non" :D
  - throwaway744678 6y ago
    Engrenages, le Bureau des Légendes. You will not regret it.
    - syl_sau 6y ago
      As a français, I second this. I'm extremely critical of most TV shows and I tend to quit very fast when get the impression I'm losing time. Engrenages is about the only TV shows I am able to watch in french, and it's a really good one. I'd would say, frankly, that it's our equivalent to The Wire.
  - bertil 6y ago
    For an learner who wants to understand, I’d strongly recommend _Le petit prince_e and _L’homme qui plantait des arbres_. Both about an hour long, beautifully animated, adapted verbatim from books that have easy to find translations. Both as meant for children (and adult who think like them) so you might feel condescended to — but both have a very simple, classic language, distinctly articulated that makes it easier to follow for foreigners. The stories are wonderful too: about what makes a life worthwhile and conservation. The other recommendation I’d make are: * audio-books that might not have movie equivalent: the accent in _Regain_, by the same Giono as _L’homme qui plantait des arbres_ has me to tears; * any version of Criminal (the UK one was popular but the French, German and Spanish one are great too); all have the same minimal set and nothing but dialogue (it feels like a hilarious and successful exercise in saving money on production); * hopefully _Lupin_: it’s brand new, I haven’t watched it yet but friends say it’s great. It seems to have a wide variety of contemporary accents, fast paced dialogue so not for the early learner.
chrisandchips 6y ago
> Also, I learned that the french in school is nothing like the french they speak in France. Sure, you get by and they'll understand you, but french relies heavy on vernacular, sayings and expressions. Virtually everyone who learns a language in school as you described will feel this way when they encounter native speakers in the target language's country(s) of origin. The reality of school teaching is that it enforces prescriptive snapshots of the language. It teaches the grammatical "rules" of a language at a moment in time, but these rules are always changing. Common English has changed a lot since 1800; consider how different an English class in 1800s might be from one now, though they are both valid in being called English classes. The classes continue exist, but they are often lingering behind the real deal. Language is developed naturally by our minds, and its inner workings are still largely unknown to us. The best way to learn it is by actual exposure to it, as it is meant to be used. You are always going to be removed from this reality if you are sitting in a classroom with minimal direct exposure.
- f430 6y ago
  I can literally hear La pizza song [1] in my head as I read your comment which is pretty much all I remember from elementary school. It was only in my final year of high school that our teacher who was from Paris really pushed us and it didn't involve us singing awkward songs. Now I have PTSD everytime I see or eat pizza, the song plays in my head, like some sick Pavlov experiment. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_j3hPW3pvOw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_j3hPW3pvOw
robotmay 6y ago
Every time I try to pronounce "Auvergne" to a French person they quite literally cannot comprehend what I'm aiming for. It's pretty remarkable that I've been trying for years at this point and still can't get it right! I can manage Clermont-Ferrand at least so I can sort of fudge what I mean using that but still, it would be nice to figure it out one day :D
- bertil 6y ago
  Auvergne has a lot of the sounds that are almost impossible to get right: 'au' has few equivalent other than the Scandinavian 'å' (and they rarely make the connection), 'v' is muted, the wet 'gn' sounds like the Spanish 'll' but is hard for even then to put in the middle of a word — and the unheard final 'e' will trip anyone in the country for less than two decade. “Bonjour“ and “croissant” are classic examples too: the opening 'b' is muted, 'j' only exist in some arabic dialect, etc. I used to live near the Louvre and the hundreds of tourist ordering at the local bakery were offended that, pointing at the pastries and articulating as much as they could, the baker would claim to have no idea what they wanted. I had to explain that she genuinely couldn’t understand and she was sincerely confused at them pointing at a croissant and asking for a “Keurrawssanteu”. Those two things could not be the same — it’s not an accent: someone from Switwzerland or Quebec would have no problem even though they sound completely different. I could make sense because I spoke English. “But I’m speaking in French…” Well… almost.
triceratops 6y ago
> (I totally dig their counting system though, septante, huitante et nonante makes so much more sense). French beginner, holy shit I'm just gonna use that if I ever speak with native speakers. I'll tell 'em I learned in Switzerland. soixante-dix and quatre-vingt-dix is bonkers!
pwillia7 6y ago
Redoing counting was the best thing the Swiss may have ever done.

brnt 6y ago

What's interesting and weird to me: both Dutch and French speakers from Belgium (so, Flemish and Walloon people) often sound like they have the same accent when speaking English! To me at least. Anybody else noticed this?

dep_b 6y ago
French R and soft G are shared among other things between the French and people from the South of Holland and below.
roelschroeven 6y ago
And Flemish people have a totally different accent when speaking English than Dutch people. TO my ears most Dutch people have a distinct English accent; some more than others, but almost always identifiable as from Dutch origin. Walter Lewin (as in e.g. https://youtu.be/sJG-rXBbmCc https://youtu.be/sJG-rXBbmCc) is a quite extreme example, despite the fact that he has lived in the US since 1966. Carice van Houten (Melisandre in Game of Thrones) has it too but less pronounced. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that Flemish people have a distinct English accent too, and that I simply don't notice it as much (being Flemish myself). Germans speaking English are often recognizable as well.
- JW_00000 6y ago
  > I wouldn't be surprised to learn that Flemish people have a distinct English accent too Yes! One thing I sometimes notice is that, in Flemish we pronounce "wat is" as "wadis", and sometimes Flemish people in English will also say "Whad is". So Flemish people end up saying "Whad is dat?" instead of "What is that?". (Also lots of "eh?"s and the occasional "allez" pop up.)
JW_00000 6y ago
As a Flemish person, I wouldn't say Flemish and Walloon have the same accent in English, but I guess I'm not the one to judge. What is funny though, is that _in English_, you can sometimes detect different Flemish accents, i.e. when someone is speaking in English, I can tell whether they're from West-Flanders, from Antwerp, or from Limburg (in the east of Flanders). Their typical Flemish accent seeps through in their English. Also, the Dutch have the same accent in English as they do in Dutch (compared to the Flemish variant of Dutch).
ilamont 6y ago
Godfather was Walloon, ex-roommate was Flemish. Very different accents when speaking English - my godfather sounded like a French person, the Flemish roommate could be mistaken for a Scandinavian ... also notable that he sounded nothing like a Dutch person, who in my experience have very good British or North American "clean" accents.

mistahenry 6y ago

I'm an American living in Germany and I'm always thrilled when Germans think I'm Dutch after hearing my German ;) As for the accents, I had a similar experience when moving around from Berlin to Munich to Mainz with regard to the "clicking". It's like my brain suddenly recalibrated to understand the vowel and consonant changes in the accent (and particularly in certain areas the parts of the words that simply were dropped off the beginning/end of the word). People often tell me "Wow, I wish I was good at languages like you" and I honestly want them to understand how I feel: I didn't learn German, I simply spent enough time in the language for my brain to catch up and learn it for me.

dep_b 6y ago
Because you sound like the guy who dubbed Goldeneye to them! (JK ;) )

antb123 6y ago

Canadian (anglo) here that went to French immersion (teachers were mostly from France). I don't really have an accent which sucks. People just think I am a stupid French person who makes grammatical mistakes here and there and has a more limited vocabulary set. I am jealous of my American friends who speak with heavy accents and receive praise about their mastery.

ftio 6y ago
In this boat with my Italian. Northerners think I'm from the South. Southerners think I'm from Rome. Imagine their surprise when I tell them I'm from another Italy... Staten Italy.
- GEBBL 6y ago
  Is that in staten island?
  - ftio 6y ago
    Staten Island == Staten Italy Staten Island has a very large population of Italian-Americans. Italian-American culture pervades many facets of Staten Island life and culture, even among non-Italians — so much so that many residents (and former residents like me) sometimes jokingly refer to it as Staten Italy.
- davidw 6y ago
  Hah, I had this happen when doing some work in Rome. The CEO of the startup remarked that I had a heavy American accent, which... I was a bit taken aback by, because I rarely hear that, and I work hard to speak Italian well. Later, he heard me speaking with another guy at the company who was from near where I lived in Padova, and it dawned on him (I don't think he was the sharpest tool in the shed) that my accent was more 'Veneto' than American.
jedimastert 6y ago
> I don't really have an accent which sucks. People just think I am a stupid French person who makes grammatical mistakes here and there and has a more limited vocabulary set. I recently stumbled across a French/English comedy special which has a bit specifically about this, and how much French people judge other French people's French. I have absolutely zero experience with French and I still found most of the clips entertaining https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FIqVY1SwXls https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FIqVY1SwXls

idoubtit 6y ago

> french relies heavy on vernacular, sayings and expressions. It's more than that. There's a growing divergence between the spoken French and the written French. Où irions-nous ? Nous hésitâmes... (written French) On allait où ? On a hésité... (spoken French) Writings from the XVIIth century bare little difference to most modern novels. Of course, some words have evolved (e.g. "caresser" was akin to "praise", now it's more like "pet" or "fondle") but the grammar and the vocabulary is mostly identical. Centuries ago, the langage spoken was already different from what was written. I think the main difference was that there were many local variations, like shown in the Littré dictionary (1870s). The uniformization came with WWI, then the modern communication.

dirktheman 6y ago
Yes, they don't teach you the "on a...", "faire le truc avec...", "ouais" and "ca marche" at school, altough everyone uses this. I just wish schools would prepare you a little better for the difference between writing and speaking. My daughter learned to say "chouette, c'est jolie!" in her french class, which is preposterous and almost akin to saying 'Jolly gay, old chap!' in English today.
- pmezard 6y ago
  > My daughter learned to say "chouette, c'est joli !" in her french class, which is preposterous and almost akin to saying 'Jolly gay, old chap!' in English today. Don't be so harsh. I would not be surprised to hear a child (~6/8 years old) say that, assuming some kind of polite/policed family background. > Yes, they don't teach you the "on a...", "faire le truc avec...", "ouais" and "ca marche" Imagine us watching Stringer Bell from "The Wire" for the first time. Or listening to pop or rap. Or chatting with native speakers. We just have more exposure.
  - lqet 6y ago
    > Imagine us watching Stringer Bell from "The Wire" for the first time. I tried to watch "The Wire" without English subtitles 10 years ago. No chance. I could barely make out individual words. After a season with subtitles, it just clicked.

martincmartin 6y ago

Have you ever gone to Quebec, or heard that accent?

dirktheman 6y ago
Never been there, but I met a french-speaking couple from Montreal once. I could understand them just fine, but couldn't place the accent. It didn't really occur to me hearing white people speaking french were from another country than France. (My former neighbour was from Congo and I was able to converse with him in french although his patois was hard to follow).
- younohoo 6y ago
  It is said that the Quebec French accent is the same as was spoken in France in the 1600’s and hasn’t changed that much over the years whereas the French accent, has. I’m not sure if this is true, however.
  - kergonath 6y ago
    I think it’s a case of divergent evolution. We notice archaic phrases because they are funny, but québécois French also evolves.
  - Bayart 6y ago
    That's bad popular linguistics. Québec French has kept features that are archaic by Mainland French standards (the most blatant being the unfinished separation of oi and ai, which was solidified around the French Revolution), but it also has its own innovated features. You've got the same thing going on with American accents, and some of them keeping older English features. Simon Roper made a nice video about that [1]. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4rb0HPDnc8Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4rb0HPDnc8Y

misiti3780 6y ago

Not sure if you are a wine drinker, but the natural wines coming out of Auvergne are absolutely delicious! Some of the most interesting wines in the world IMO.

hobby-coder-guy 6y ago

Ninety-nine makes a lot more sense than four-twenty-ten-nine.

geebee 6y ago

I often watch French language tv shows or movies to keep up my language skills. I recently watched "Call my agent." Way better than "Versailles" ;) Thing is, it's very difficult for me to understand. But I realized that if I put on CC in French, I can understand it no problem, almost as well as if the CC was in English. But without the CC, I can't understand it well enough to enjoy the show. This leads me to believe that my difficulty in understanding spoken vs written French might not be so much grammar and vocab of spoken French, but rather the difficulty of translating sounds to words in real time. I really should leave the CC off entirely, but I want to enjoy the show, so for now, my compromise is to watch with CC in French. I am almost certainly compromising my language skills this way, though.

robotmay 6y ago
I asked some French friends if there was any good French TV that I could watch to learn more, but also enjoy at the same time. They started talking amongst themselves and I honestly thought they hadn't heard me, until about 5 minutes later they turned back and just said: "Non" :D
- throwaway744678 6y ago
  Engrenages, le Bureau des Légendes. You will not regret it.
  - syl_sau 6y ago
    As a français, I second this. I'm extremely critical of most TV shows and I tend to quit very fast when get the impression I'm losing time. Engrenages is about the only TV shows I am able to watch in french, and it's a really good one. I'd would say, frankly, that it's our equivalent to The Wire.
- bertil 6y ago
  For an learner who wants to understand, I’d strongly recommend _Le petit prince_e and _L’homme qui plantait des arbres_. Both about an hour long, beautifully animated, adapted verbatim from books that have easy to find translations. Both as meant for children (and adult who think like them) so you might feel condescended to — but both have a very simple, classic language, distinctly articulated that makes it easier to follow for foreigners. The stories are wonderful too: about what makes a life worthwhile and conservation. The other recommendation I’d make are: * audio-books that might not have movie equivalent: the accent in _Regain_, by the same Giono as _L’homme qui plantait des arbres_ has me to tears; * any version of Criminal (the UK one was popular but the French, German and Spanish one are great too); all have the same minimal set and nothing but dialogue (it feels like a hilarious and successful exercise in saving money on production); * hopefully _Lupin_: it’s brand new, I haven’t watched it yet but friends say it’s great. It seems to have a wide variety of contemporary accents, fast paced dialogue so not for the early learner.

chrisandchips 6y ago

> Also, I learned that the french in school is nothing like the french they speak in France. Sure, you get by and they'll understand you, but french relies heavy on vernacular, sayings and expressions. Virtually everyone who learns a language in school as you described will feel this way when they encounter native speakers in the target language's country(s) of origin. The reality of school teaching is that it enforces prescriptive snapshots of the language. It teaches the grammatical "rules" of a language at a moment in time, but these rules are always changing. Common English has changed a lot since 1800; consider how different an English class in 1800s might be from one now, though they are both valid in being called English classes. The classes continue exist, but they are often lingering behind the real deal. Language is developed naturally by our minds, and its inner workings are still largely unknown to us. The best way to learn it is by actual exposure to it, as it is meant to be used. You are always going to be removed from this reality if you are sitting in a classroom with minimal direct exposure.

f430 6y ago
I can literally hear La pizza song [1] in my head as I read your comment which is pretty much all I remember from elementary school. It was only in my final year of high school that our teacher who was from Paris really pushed us and it didn't involve us singing awkward songs. Now I have PTSD everytime I see or eat pizza, the song plays in my head, like some sick Pavlov experiment. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_j3hPW3pvOw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_j3hPW3pvOw

robotmay 6y ago

Every time I try to pronounce "Auvergne" to a French person they quite literally cannot comprehend what I'm aiming for. It's pretty remarkable that I've been trying for years at this point and still can't get it right! I can manage Clermont-Ferrand at least so I can sort of fudge what I mean using that but still, it would be nice to figure it out one day :D

bertil 6y ago
Auvergne has a lot of the sounds that are almost impossible to get right: 'au' has few equivalent other than the Scandinavian 'å' (and they rarely make the connection), 'v' is muted, the wet 'gn' sounds like the Spanish 'll' but is hard for even then to put in the middle of a word — and the unheard final 'e' will trip anyone in the country for less than two decade. “Bonjour“ and “croissant” are classic examples too: the opening 'b' is muted, 'j' only exist in some arabic dialect, etc. I used to live near the Louvre and the hundreds of tourist ordering at the local bakery were offended that, pointing at the pastries and articulating as much as they could, the baker would claim to have no idea what they wanted. I had to explain that she genuinely couldn’t understand and she was sincerely confused at them pointing at a croissant and asking for a “Keurrawssanteu”. Those two things could not be the same — it’s not an accent: someone from Switwzerland or Quebec would have no problem even though they sound completely different. I could make sense because I spoke English. “But I’m speaking in French…” Well… almost.

triceratops 6y ago

> (I totally dig their counting system though, septante, huitante et nonante makes so much more sense). French beginner, holy shit I'm just gonna use that if I ever speak with native speakers. I'll tell 'em I learned in Switzerland. soixante-dix and quatre-vingt-dix is bonkers!

pwillia7 6y ago

Redoing counting was the best thing the Swiss may have ever done.