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I really appreciate your reply and the global perspective! That said, I'm not sure about Germany being approximately as rough as the U.S.. * Retirement - Our

by mapgrep 15y ago

I really appreciate your reply and the global perspective! That said, I'm not sure about Germany being approximately as rough as the U.S.. * Retirement - Our benefit is well under half of yours. The _minimum_ German pension, the floor, after reform will be 67 percent of national average wage (cites below). In the U.S., the average social security benefit is $1,153, annualized to $13,863 or about 34 percent of the average national income of $40,711. So our _average_ govt. retirement benefit (34%) is about half of your _minimum_ retirement benefit (67%). In fact, the maximum U.S. benefit of $2,346 is just 69 percent of national income, i.e. the current German minimum (!) (it will go down to 67 percent under the current reform). [German data: http://www.economist.com/node/618334 http://www.economist.com/node/618334 ] [U.S. social security benefit data: http://www.aarp.org/work/social-security/info-07-2010/maximum_monthly_social_security_benefit.html http://www.aarp.org/work/social-security/info-07-2010/maximu... ][U.S. wage data: http://www.ssa.gov/oact/cola/AWI.html http://www.ssa.gov/oact/cola/AWI.html ] * Unemployment - (-edited thrice-) The average is 47 percent of wages in U.S. vs 60 or 67 percent in Germany depending on if you have kids. Germany is still more generous. [German data http://www.oecd.org/dataoecd/9/54/29730499.PDF http://www.oecd.org/dataoecd/9/54/29730499.PDF http://www.justlanded.com/english/Germany/Germany-Guide/Jobs/Unemployment-insurance http://www.justlanded.com/english/Germany/Germany-Guide/Jobs... ] [U.S. data http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=3394 http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=3394 ] If you are right about "housings costs + 500 per month" this is, indeed, be about in line with U.S. benefits which average $300 per week (~1300 per month); our housing payments average $684. Not sure how to reconcile that with the 60 percent figure from OECD and elsewhere.

wheels 15y ago
What I meant on the German and US systems is that they're both pay-in-get-something out. Germans pay about double for social security, so it's not a huge surprise that the benefits are higher. My point was not that Germans do not get more benefits, but that's it's not a large factor in contrasting wages. (i.e. if American professionals put the money into a 401k that would go into the required German pension funding, then the benefits would probably work out to being roughly comparable). For unemployment the housing costs that are reimbursed are "reasonable" costs, not "whatever your costs are", i.e. they're capped per region. The 60% you're seeing there is for those who have paid for "Arbeitslosengeld I", which is only available to those who have been full-time employed and are terminated (though if you quit on your own, you're eligible after 3 months). Freelancers, recent grads, business owners, etc. are not eligible for "ALG I". There's also a time limit on how long you can receive it.
- DasIch 15y ago
  That time limit is two years. After that you get "Hartz IV" unless you still have enough money to live by. Sure if that happens you may have to drastically change your lifestyle but if you are well educated getting a job in under two years should be achievable.
  - moe 15y ago
    The timelimit is actually one year or less for most people. You only get 2 years when you're older than 58. For anyone else it depends on how long you've been employed before applying for unemployment support. Been employed for longer than 24mo? You get 12mo support. Been employed for only 12mo? Then you get only 6mo of support.
patrickg 15y ago
That retirement you mention is only partly true (unless there is a misunderstanding). It all depends how many years you have paid into the fund. For a women with lots of breaks due to kids or for self employed people who have not opted in paying into the fund, this is getting lower and lower.

by mapgrep 15y ago

wheels 15y ago

What I meant on the German and US systems is that they're both pay-in-get-something out. Germans pay about double for social security, so it's not a huge surprise that the benefits are higher. My point was not that Germans do not get more benefits, but that's it's not a large factor in contrasting wages. (i.e. if American professionals put the money into a 401k that would go into the required German pension funding, then the benefits would probably work out to being roughly comparable). For unemployment the housing costs that are reimbursed are "reasonable" costs, not "whatever your costs are", i.e. they're capped per region. The 60% you're seeing there is for those who have paid for "Arbeitslosengeld I", which is only available to those who have been full-time employed and are terminated (though if you quit on your own, you're eligible after 3 months). Freelancers, recent grads, business owners, etc. are not eligible for "ALG I". There's also a time limit on how long you can receive it.

DasIch 15y ago
That time limit is two years. After that you get "Hartz IV" unless you still have enough money to live by. Sure if that happens you may have to drastically change your lifestyle but if you are well educated getting a job in under two years should be achievable.
- moe 15y ago
  The timelimit is actually one year or less for most people. You only get 2 years when you're older than 58. For anyone else it depends on how long you've been employed before applying for unemployment support. Been employed for longer than 24mo? You get 12mo support. Been employed for only 12mo? Then you get only 6mo of support.

patrickg 15y ago

That retirement you mention is only partly true (unless there is a misunderstanding). It all depends how many years you have paid into the fund. For a women with lots of breaks due to kids or for self employed people who have not opted in paying into the fund, this is getting lower and lower.