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> there is always a conspiracy against them Given that they are referred to as Fascists/Nazis, along with the notion that punching Nazis is ok; Seems to me the

by Chris2048 6y ago

> there is always a conspiracy against them Given that they are referred to as Fascists/Nazis, along with the notion that punching Nazis is ok; Seems to me there is a conspiracy, a pretty open/explicit one.

smokelegend 6y ago
Seems weird, a country that fought nazi's & fascist during WW2 would have a problem today with nazi's & fascist in their own country. Do nazi's deserve to be punched in the face? In the US, yes All Nazi's should be punched in the face. We fought a war over this already, it's not open for debate. It's not a conspiracy, nazi's are bad. FULL STOP!
- Chris2048 6y ago
  not open to debate? How dare you dictate my freedoms. Does that I mean I can call you a Nazi? It's almost as if the allies fought against actual Nazis, and MAGAs are different - is that open for debate?
LatteLazy 6y ago
If you associate with Nazis, court their votes, and called them "very fine people" then you cannot be surprised people think you're a nazi, and by extension a fascist...
- Chris2048 6y ago
  This is all just semantic. I can do the same - plenty BLM protests included rioters and looters, so anyone supporting the protests supports looting, associates with rioters, courts their votes etc. Trump didn't say the Fascists at Charlottesville where "very fine people", he said "you also had people that were very fine people, on both sides", making a point not applicable to the whole group, in general, and in fact that applies as much to antifa/the opposition. Instead this nuance (and the context that he was talking in the context of both sides) is dropped in paraphrases such as yours. I can't say what Trump really feels, or if a broader context suggest he's just playing dangerous politics anyway - but you are twisting his word, or at least his meaning via selective quoting, in a pretty obvious manner. https://www.politifact.com/article/2019/apr/26/context-trumps-very-fine-people-both-sides-remarks/ https://www.politifact.com/article/2019/apr/26/context-trump...
  - LatteLazy 6y ago
    I'd be much happier applying nuance if I didn't feel like I (we?) was being fooled: trump refuses to distance himself from far right, nazi and fascist groups. The fact he hasn't explicitly and publicly embraced them isn't evidence of innocence. It just means he is engaged in dog-whistle politics. He gets Nazis on board by being inspecific about who is a "very fine person", then you and I argue over whether he is just dumb or actively a nazi. That let's non-Nazis support him without having to explicitly be Pro-nazi and keeps the Nazis on board. He's built a big tent, made some racist statements and closed his eyes as the Nazis flooded in. If you get into bed with a nazi, you're in bed with a nazi, even if you pretend you can't see their flags. I actually think trump is a "nazi of convenience" rather than a real, ideological nazi. He pushes their ideals and covers for them in exchange for their votes. He doesn't actually care about them more than anyone else. They're a means to an end. The same with coal miners or the religious. He doesn't care about abortion, he wants their votes and their money. The difference is that to be religious, you need to actually believe, to be a looter you have to actually loot, but to be a nazi, you just need to work with and help nazi, you don't need the tattoo and the party membership card... "You don't have to be a racist to support trump, but racism has to have not been a deal breaker for you" Sorry this is so long, I'm not smart enough to make it shorter!

smokelegend 6y ago

Seems weird, a country that fought nazi's & fascist during WW2 would have a problem today with nazi's & fascist in their own country. Do nazi's deserve to be punched in the face? In the US, yes All Nazi's should be punched in the face. We fought a war over this already, it's not open for debate. It's not a conspiracy, nazi's are bad. FULL STOP!

Chris2048 6y ago
not open to debate? How dare you dictate my freedoms. Does that I mean I can call you a Nazi? It's almost as if the allies fought against actual Nazis, and MAGAs are different - is that open for debate?

LatteLazy 6y ago

If you associate with Nazis, court their votes, and called them "very fine people" then you cannot be surprised people think you're a nazi, and by extension a fascist...

Chris2048 6y ago
This is all just semantic. I can do the same - plenty BLM protests included rioters and looters, so anyone supporting the protests supports looting, associates with rioters, courts their votes etc. Trump didn't say the Fascists at Charlottesville where "very fine people", he said "you also had people that were very fine people, on both sides", making a point not applicable to the whole group, in general, and in fact that applies as much to antifa/the opposition. Instead this nuance (and the context that he was talking in the context of both sides) is dropped in paraphrases such as yours. I can't say what Trump really feels, or if a broader context suggest he's just playing dangerous politics anyway - but you are twisting his word, or at least his meaning via selective quoting, in a pretty obvious manner. https://www.politifact.com/article/2019/apr/26/context-trumps-very-fine-people-both-sides-remarks/ https://www.politifact.com/article/2019/apr/26/context-trump...
- LatteLazy 6y ago
  I'd be much happier applying nuance if I didn't feel like I (we?) was being fooled: trump refuses to distance himself from far right, nazi and fascist groups. The fact he hasn't explicitly and publicly embraced them isn't evidence of innocence. It just means he is engaged in dog-whistle politics. He gets Nazis on board by being inspecific about who is a "very fine person", then you and I argue over whether he is just dumb or actively a nazi. That let's non-Nazis support him without having to explicitly be Pro-nazi and keeps the Nazis on board. He's built a big tent, made some racist statements and closed his eyes as the Nazis flooded in. If you get into bed with a nazi, you're in bed with a nazi, even if you pretend you can't see their flags. I actually think trump is a "nazi of convenience" rather than a real, ideological nazi. He pushes their ideals and covers for them in exchange for their votes. He doesn't actually care about them more than anyone else. They're a means to an end. The same with coal miners or the religious. He doesn't care about abortion, he wants their votes and their money. The difference is that to be religious, you need to actually believe, to be a looter you have to actually loot, but to be a nazi, you just need to work with and help nazi, you don't need the tattoo and the party membership card... "You don't have to be a racist to support trump, but racism has to have not been a deal breaker for you" Sorry this is so long, I'm not smart enough to make it shorter!