4 ms·

old internet wasn't as centralized even if you pissed off one admin there were million others

smt88 6y ago
Old internet was more centralized. Your site essentially didn't exist unless AOL knew about it. There were only a few big webhosts a long time, and it was nontrivial to run your own server -- especially because a lot of ISPs banned it unless you paid a lot more every month. So for a long time, you options were: host on one of the big services (Geocities, for example) or run your own server. Now there are potentially millions of hosts. The centralization problem is exclusive to search, but you can still change search engines if it bothers you.
- Miner49er 6y ago
  Maybe really old, but things are definitely more centralized then it was at the peak. IRC and forums are dead. Everyone has moved to things like FB and reddit, who have then killed off and censored many of these communities.
  - smt88 6y ago
    So when was the "peak" for you, and what was different? > IRC and forums are dead. IRC was always doomed because it wasn't discoverable or usable for a typical person. I think it's more fair to complain that XMPP/Jabber died, because those were widely used by everyone who used Google Talk (and the original FB Messenger maybe?) and then were killed off. The big companies have done some awful bait-and-switch in terms of interop. > Everyone has moved to things like FB and reddit, who have then killed off and censored many of these communities. I think the perspective you are missing is that the censorship is the value for a lot of people. I personally didn't start using reddit until they started actively banning neo-Nazis and abandoning their "everything except violence is fine" policy. The ultimate unregulated venues used to be (or maybe still are) forums, and I personally run a niche industry forum that has a lot of traffic. The problem with forums is that they require extensive, aggressive moderation to prevent spam just as a starter. Then what you're left with is a choice of what culture you want. Do you want a mainstream culture that appeals to lots of people? Because you can't have that unless you create the kinds of rules that the corporate giants have created. In summary, I think the issue with censorship is that everyone loves it and wants it in their social networks, but no one can 100% agree on what should be censored or not.

Old internet was more centralized. Your site essentially didn't exist unless AOL knew about it. There were only a few big webhosts a long time, and it was nontrivial to run your own server -- especially because a lot of ISPs banned it unless you paid a lot more every month. So for a long time, you options were: host on one of the big services (Geocities, for example) or run your own server. Now there are potentially millions of hosts. The centralization problem is exclusive to search, but you can still change search engines if it bothers you.

Miner49er 6y ago
Maybe really old, but things are definitely more centralized then it was at the peak. IRC and forums are dead. Everyone has moved to things like FB and reddit, who have then killed off and censored many of these communities.
- smt88 6y ago
  So when was the "peak" for you, and what was different? > IRC and forums are dead. IRC was always doomed because it wasn't discoverable or usable for a typical person. I think it's more fair to complain that XMPP/Jabber died, because those were widely used by everyone who used Google Talk (and the original FB Messenger maybe?) and then were killed off. The big companies have done some awful bait-and-switch in terms of interop. > Everyone has moved to things like FB and reddit, who have then killed off and censored many of these communities. I think the perspective you are missing is that the censorship is the value for a lot of people. I personally didn't start using reddit until they started actively banning neo-Nazis and abandoning their "everything except violence is fine" policy. The ultimate unregulated venues used to be (or maybe still are) forums, and I personally run a niche industry forum that has a lot of traffic. The problem with forums is that they require extensive, aggressive moderation to prevent spam just as a starter. Then what you're left with is a choice of what culture you want. Do you want a mainstream culture that appeals to lots of people? Because you can't have that unless you create the kinds of rules that the corporate giants have created. In summary, I think the issue with censorship is that everyone loves it and wants it in their social networks, but no one can 100% agree on what should be censored or not.