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The stakes are so high for Amazon to tell the truth here. If they were lying then there would be outrage among users, media, competition, etc. I’ve dealt with

The stakes are so high for Amazon to tell the truth here. If they were lying then there would be outrage among users, media, competition, etc. I’ve dealt with many people from Amazon in my professional life and based on their handling of customer data I believe Amazon take seriously the trust customers place with them. Amazon believe the Alexa and Echo platform will grow their retail and service relationships with customers. I don’t think they would throw that away to fool us all into believing a fake mute button - for what?

everdrive 6y ago
I think both you, and the parent you're responding to are correct. Amazon is not evil, they're merely self-interested. This can lead them to do some evil things, but they are not a cartoon villain, twisting their mustache in shadows. On the other hand, it's important to verify claims, and Amazon should be very happy about this verification. It proves that their claim could be trusted. Some other conclusion could have just as easily been true.
darepublic 6y ago
I'm honestly not sure what the public response would be. I'm inclined to believe the revelation that the microphone is always on would not effect bottom line too much. Though maybe if a good meme campaign materialized people would join in on the public flagellation. But I bet more on people appetite for a public lynching than sacrificing their own convenience for long term considerations
verbify 6y ago
Couldn't they have implemented mute in software? There would be little outrage if they had (users don't care about the difference) but spy agencies (e.g. NSO Group) would have a backdoor. The fact that they used a hardware switch means they did it the right way. By contrast my Logitech camera has a light to show when the camera is running - but the light can be disabled via their software which makes me uncomfortable with fully trusting the light.
- cmiles74 6y ago
  This is a good point, I had suspected that the mute function was, in fact, implemented in software. That they went ahead and implemented in hardware is encouraging. Someone over there took the feature seriously enough to take it this far. I am sure it added cost over a software-only solution.
- jsight 6y ago
  They could have, but I believe in the past they have claimed it to be hardware.
- sib 6y ago
  When we discussed this - at long length - during the original Echo development program, we consistently came to the conclusion that it should be hardware, not software, to maintain customer trust.
  - Shared404 6y ago
    IMHO, This was the correct choice. No one I know would trust a software mute.
    - sib 6y ago
      Yeah... I thought it was pretty clear. While still hoping that we could build something (product & reputation) that users wouldn't want to turn off.
  - mgdev 6y ago
    I know you. :) #doppler4lyfe
    - sib 6y ago
      Took me a couple of minutes to figure out who you are :) Still proud of this product!
  - sushisource 6y ago
iratewizard 6y ago
Amazon is treated as if it were Google, despite not having quite the same track record. Amazon has walked a thin ethical line in terms of managing their labor force, but I haven't seen the same level of involvement in things like PRISM.
jgalt212 6y ago
> I don’t think they would throw that away to fool us all into believing a fake mute button - for what? True, but what is the incentive for Amazon to behave given their dominant market position? Customers might not have viable alternatives.
- vineyardmike 6y ago
  They don't have a huge market lead if at all (i've seen conflicting reports) and there are 3rd party Alexa products that compete indirectly. Considering how many new devices they churn out and how cheap they are to replace, probs good to maintain public opinion for years
anotherforsure 6y ago
"outrage among users, media, competition, etc." You really believe this? Still? Amazon is so big that the loss of outraged users is a rounding error to them. Ford used to let cars off the line missing bolts. They're still here because their pockets are deep enough to wait until people forget.

everdrive 6y ago

I think both you, and the parent you're responding to are correct. Amazon is not evil, they're merely self-interested. This can lead them to do some evil things, but they are not a cartoon villain, twisting their mustache in shadows. On the other hand, it's important to verify claims, and Amazon should be very happy about this verification. It proves that their claim could be trusted. Some other conclusion could have just as easily been true.

darepublic 6y ago

I'm honestly not sure what the public response would be. I'm inclined to believe the revelation that the microphone is always on would not effect bottom line too much. Though maybe if a good meme campaign materialized people would join in on the public flagellation. But I bet more on people appetite for a public lynching than sacrificing their own convenience for long term considerations

verbify 6y ago

Couldn't they have implemented mute in software? There would be little outrage if they had (users don't care about the difference) but spy agencies (e.g. NSO Group) would have a backdoor. The fact that they used a hardware switch means they did it the right way. By contrast my Logitech camera has a light to show when the camera is running - but the light can be disabled via their software which makes me uncomfortable with fully trusting the light.

cmiles74 6y ago
This is a good point, I had suspected that the mute function was, in fact, implemented in software. That they went ahead and implemented in hardware is encouraging. Someone over there took the feature seriously enough to take it this far. I am sure it added cost over a software-only solution.
jsight 6y ago
They could have, but I believe in the past they have claimed it to be hardware.
sib 6y ago
When we discussed this - at long length - during the original Echo development program, we consistently came to the conclusion that it should be hardware, not software, to maintain customer trust.
- Shared404 6y ago
  IMHO, This was the correct choice. No one I know would trust a software mute.
  - sib 6y ago
    Yeah... I thought it was pretty clear. While still hoping that we could build something (product & reputation) that users wouldn't want to turn off.
- mgdev 6y ago
  I know you. :) #doppler4lyfe
  - sib 6y ago
    Took me a couple of minutes to figure out who you are :) Still proud of this product!
- sushisource 6y ago

iratewizard 6y ago

Amazon is treated as if it were Google, despite not having quite the same track record. Amazon has walked a thin ethical line in terms of managing their labor force, but I haven't seen the same level of involvement in things like PRISM.

jgalt212 6y ago

> I don’t think they would throw that away to fool us all into believing a fake mute button - for what? True, but what is the incentive for Amazon to behave given their dominant market position? Customers might not have viable alternatives.

vineyardmike 6y ago
They don't have a huge market lead if at all (i've seen conflicting reports) and there are 3rd party Alexa products that compete indirectly. Considering how many new devices they churn out and how cheap they are to replace, probs good to maintain public opinion for years

anotherforsure 6y ago

"outrage among users, media, competition, etc." You really believe this? Still? Amazon is so big that the loss of outraged users is a rounding error to them. Ford used to let cars off the line missing bolts. They're still here because their pockets are deep enough to wait until people forget.