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All you're pointing out here is the obvious fact that when you are in a run-up to a civil war, the way it goes is one of continuing escalation and distrust, eac

by gfodor 6y ago

All you're pointing out here is the obvious fact that when you are in a run-up to a civil war, the way it goes is one of continuing escalation and distrust, each side building off of the other's previous norm breaking. We had election distrust then, we have a more potent version now. We had violent riots this summer, we have a more potent one now that that norm is now broken. Both of the recent events have opened the door for the next logical escalation: creation of new domestic terrorism laws which will find a way to turn people who question the election or are associated in opinion of the most recent rioters as terrorists. And on the other side, bombs and other violent acts to destroy things like the assets of tech companies who are suppressing speech, and more violent, less "selfie-oriented" insurrectionist action into government seats of power. And in case you think I'm saying one side "started it", I'm not. I'm talking about the two prior events on this track, one of many tracks leading us down this road. Nobody can remember when it started, but it was obvious to me years ago that the hatred and psychological manipulation we are under was going to lead here. And we're not at the end, we're at the midpoint at best. Hypocrisy is ignored, since to recognize it would risk having to admit profound judgement errors. And it would risk losing power, since the other side would capitalize on this as weakness and an admission that they were right all along. Better to dig in, especially if you can't imagine it will ever get to the point where people are breaking into your house and trying to kill you because of a sign that was on your lawn a few months ago according to Google Maps. Those focused on accusing people (like me) of being biased by "both-sidsing" when we point out the now obvious pattern of escalation, the transparent memory holing or double standards and hypocrisy revealed by those trying to force the debate into minor semantic quibbles (like you are) to score a point about "who was more wrong" are the people they write about in the history books that contributed to the escalation and eventual collapse of civil society. They won't be writing about me, I assure you. Having been trying to talk sense into people on both "sides" now for years, and just seeing the tide of hatred roll over them all eventually as they retreat into their bubbles and sever relationships with the half of the country they see as (in the latest analogy) a virus, I'm about ready to give up and just be prepared to protect my family.

metabagel 6y ago
BLM protesters were mostly non-violent. https://acleddata.com/2020/09/03/demonstrations-political-violence-in-america-new-data-for-summer-2020/ https://acleddata.com/2020/09/03/demonstrations-political-vi... https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/10/16/this-summers-black-lives-matter-protesters-were-overwhelming-peaceful-our-research-finds/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/10/16/this-summ... ==================== In many instances, police reportedly began or escalated the violence, but some observers nevertheless blame the protesters. The claim that the protests are violent — even when the police started the violence — can help local, state and federal forces justify intentionally beating, gassing or kettling the people marching, or reinforces politicians’ calls for “law and order.”
- gfodor 6y ago
  If it comes, enjoy the war. It's what you want, I think, and it's what you're going to get unless people like me can win the argument that we ought to turn back before its too late. I doubt we will. Your inability to even acknowledge what I am saying, instead of trying to prove that I am condemning your tribe unfairly, at the very least should be something you, I beg you, try to understand. When cities burn, people loot, and innocent people are killed in violence, it unlocks doors for others to then walk through, particularly if those acts are argued as now being just given the right motive. This isn't an opinion, nor is it blame. It's an observation based upon history. At some point, we need to stop walking through doors and unlocking the next one for the other side to walk through. The only way that happens is through leadership or a recognition that the next door will be one too far for anyone to accept.

by gfodor 6y ago

metabagel 6y ago

BLM protesters were mostly non-violent. https://acleddata.com/2020/09/03/demonstrations-political-violence-in-america-new-data-for-summer-2020/ https://acleddata.com/2020/09/03/demonstrations-political-vi... https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/10/16/this-summers-black-lives-matter-protesters-were-overwhelming-peaceful-our-research-finds/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/10/16/this-summ... ==================== In many instances, police reportedly began or escalated the violence, but some observers nevertheless blame the protesters. The claim that the protests are violent — even when the police started the violence — can help local, state and federal forces justify intentionally beating, gassing or kettling the people marching, or reinforces politicians’ calls for “law and order.”

gfodor 6y ago
If it comes, enjoy the war. It's what you want, I think, and it's what you're going to get unless people like me can win the argument that we ought to turn back before its too late. I doubt we will. Your inability to even acknowledge what I am saying, instead of trying to prove that I am condemning your tribe unfairly, at the very least should be something you, I beg you, try to understand. When cities burn, people loot, and innocent people are killed in violence, it unlocks doors for others to then walk through, particularly if those acts are argued as now being just given the right motive. This isn't an opinion, nor is it blame. It's an observation based upon history. At some point, we need to stop walking through doors and unlocking the next one for the other side to walk through. The only way that happens is through leadership or a recognition that the next door will be one too far for anyone to accept.