2 ms·

There is a categorical difference between looting your local big box store and attempting to overturn the results of a national democratic election through viol

There is a categorical difference between looting your local big box store and attempting to overturn the results of a national democratic election through violence. Did you see the videos of the crowds shouting “hang mike pence” at the capital? The elected democratic mayors of the cities begged the crowds and the police to deescalate violence, and they sent help when called. The elected president of the US escalated conflict, was pleased when he heard initial reports of the capital being breeched, and he refused to send in the national guard to disperse protestors. The first back up that showed up to protect the capital police arrived despite trump, who had told the national guard to stand down. The call came from one of Mitch McConnell’s staffers who knew some folks in the justice department. These aren’t remotely equivalent situations. In BLM, the elected leaders made tough choices, suffered, and worked to end the conflict. Does it not reach you that the maga protests as a violent movement matter because (1) they have express the support of the president and the political power that entails and (2) they are quit literally a coup attempt, however farsical and unrealistic, aimed at the core democratic functioning of our governance structure? And (3) these weren’t isolated instances, similar events happened at like 6 state houses, earlier this year a right wing militia planned to kidnap the governor of Michigan. The power matters, burning down the government is different than burning down a Wendy’s.

sudosysgen 6y ago
An important distinction I've also noticed is that the burning down and looting done in riots this summer was an act of spontaneoud anger and rage, not a planned event in order to create fear. No one was planning the looting of a store three weeks in advance, and this is a really large difference being a riot representing the (unproductive) language of the unheard, and an insurrectionist plot.
- berneezy3 6y ago
  I'm not saying the Capitol Hill rioters should be absolved from their actions. Those who breached the capitol violently should be charged accordingly w/ the federal crimes they violated. I personally think Trump is also responsible for inciting the angry mob, and should face the according consequences. However, while there certainly were some riots in the summer done out of spontaneous rage, there certainly were planned events as well. For example, the Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone in Seattle, which lasted 3 weeks: https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2020/7/2/21310109/chop-chaz-cleared-violence-explained https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2020/7/2/21310109/ch... Also the 100 consecutive days of protest in Portland, where the federal courthouse was set on fire: https://apnews.com/article/b57315d97dd2146c4a89b4636faa7b70 https://apnews.com/article/b57315d97dd2146c4a89b4636faa7b70 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8z0jFxOmFo&ab_channel=BloombergMarketsandFinance https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8z0jFxOmFo&ab_channel=Bloom... As for the peaceful protesters on Capitol Hill, I think they tend to be a bit misunderstood as well. These folks often get grouped into the extreme right, but in reality, they are moreso moderate people who face a harsh economic reality caused by the outsourcing of manufacturing jobs, the automation of jobs, and losing jobs to regulations. They also seem to be the population most affected by the Opioid epidemic. However, the left-wing media has an agenda that is increasingly focused on identity politics, and not the economic realities that they face. Instead, these folks are constantly painted as racist, uncultured, and extreme by the left-wing media. So lots of them are left with no choice but to support Trump in spite of his delusions, not for them. So I personally don't paint the entirety of the MAGA crowd as the enemy; many are reluctant supporters. But again, the insurrectionists and the violent protesters at Capitol Hill should be punished. But for sake of consistency, perhaps we should also be also outraged at the riots that occurred this past summer, especially the ones that caused loss of life and/or damaged government buildings?
- throwaway316943 6y ago
  > No one was planning the looting of a store three weeks in advance The nightly riots in Portland and other cities were planned and organized in advance through messaging and social apps as well as with physical posters. You can find the screen caps and photos online if you look. There were also several instances where groups of people were arrested after crossing state lines to attend riots. Both sides have bad actors and no one is absolved. The main contention here seems to be that many people rightly want the law applied equally to both sides but there is a clear bias evidenced by the amnesia or blindness that people seem to be suffering regarding the last year.
  - bitwize 6y ago
    No. Incorrect, because those riots came from the left. Again, leftist violence is always a spontaneous eruption of justified anger. Rightist violence, even from the lone-wolfiest of lone wolf attackers, is always planned and coordinated from above by coded messages from Glenn Beck, Sean Hannity, or even Trump himself.
  - sudosysgen 6y ago
    I would love a screencap of people organizing to specifically loot or damage one store specifically weeks or days in advance. I haven't seen any. If people just went to a protest expecting some possible light violence, I don't see how that's comparable. Would you make OWS or G7 protests illegal because people going there rightly expect tear gas and batons?

sudosysgen 6y ago

An important distinction I've also noticed is that the burning down and looting done in riots this summer was an act of spontaneoud anger and rage, not a planned event in order to create fear. No one was planning the looting of a store three weeks in advance, and this is a really large difference being a riot representing the (unproductive) language of the unheard, and an insurrectionist plot.

berneezy3 6y ago
I'm not saying the Capitol Hill rioters should be absolved from their actions. Those who breached the capitol violently should be charged accordingly w/ the federal crimes they violated. I personally think Trump is also responsible for inciting the angry mob, and should face the according consequences. However, while there certainly were some riots in the summer done out of spontaneous rage, there certainly were planned events as well. For example, the Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone in Seattle, which lasted 3 weeks: https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2020/7/2/21310109/chop-chaz-cleared-violence-explained https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2020/7/2/21310109/ch... Also the 100 consecutive days of protest in Portland, where the federal courthouse was set on fire: https://apnews.com/article/b57315d97dd2146c4a89b4636faa7b70 https://apnews.com/article/b57315d97dd2146c4a89b4636faa7b70 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8z0jFxOmFo&ab_channel=BloombergMarketsandFinance https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8z0jFxOmFo&ab_channel=Bloom... As for the peaceful protesters on Capitol Hill, I think they tend to be a bit misunderstood as well. These folks often get grouped into the extreme right, but in reality, they are moreso moderate people who face a harsh economic reality caused by the outsourcing of manufacturing jobs, the automation of jobs, and losing jobs to regulations. They also seem to be the population most affected by the Opioid epidemic. However, the left-wing media has an agenda that is increasingly focused on identity politics, and not the economic realities that they face. Instead, these folks are constantly painted as racist, uncultured, and extreme by the left-wing media. So lots of them are left with no choice but to support Trump in spite of his delusions, not for them. So I personally don't paint the entirety of the MAGA crowd as the enemy; many are reluctant supporters. But again, the insurrectionists and the violent protesters at Capitol Hill should be punished. But for sake of consistency, perhaps we should also be also outraged at the riots that occurred this past summer, especially the ones that caused loss of life and/or damaged government buildings?
throwaway316943 6y ago
> No one was planning the looting of a store three weeks in advance The nightly riots in Portland and other cities were planned and organized in advance through messaging and social apps as well as with physical posters. You can find the screen caps and photos online if you look. There were also several instances where groups of people were arrested after crossing state lines to attend riots. Both sides have bad actors and no one is absolved. The main contention here seems to be that many people rightly want the law applied equally to both sides but there is a clear bias evidenced by the amnesia or blindness that people seem to be suffering regarding the last year.
- bitwize 6y ago
  No. Incorrect, because those riots came from the left. Again, leftist violence is always a spontaneous eruption of justified anger. Rightist violence, even from the lone-wolfiest of lone wolf attackers, is always planned and coordinated from above by coded messages from Glenn Beck, Sean Hannity, or even Trump himself.
- sudosysgen 6y ago
  I would love a screencap of people organizing to specifically loot or damage one store specifically weeks or days in advance. I haven't seen any. If people just went to a protest expecting some possible light violence, I don't see how that's comparable. Would you make OWS or G7 protests illegal because people going there rightly expect tear gas and batons?