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The porn that has existed since the dawn of time (I guess cave paintings) is qualitatively different from PornHub content. Arguably even there is even a qualita

The porn that has existed since the dawn of time (I guess cave paintings) is qualitatively different from PornHub content. Arguably even there is even a qualitative difference from the situation even 15 years ago. Then, very few 10-year-olds would have had access to unlimited amounts of high definition hardcore porn; now probably the majority in developed countries can.

LatteLazy 6y ago
200 years ago, those 10 year olds would have seen their parents at it pretty regularly. 2000 years ago, they'd have seen everyone in the tribe with their partners.
- sushid 6y ago
  Are you sure about that? Your claim is that folks during the Enlightenment just regularly wanted into their parents having sex. And moreover you're equating porn to walking in your parents. And you're saying people in ancient Rome saw everyone in their "tribe" going at it? You do realize that humans weren't cavemen 2000 years ago, right? Ancient Rome/China/etc. had prostitutes and brothels 2000 years ago.
  - LatteLazy 6y ago
    Folks during the enlightenment were mostly illiterate peasants. Try keeping your sex life a secret when you, your brother, your wives, your parents and 6 kids/orphans all share 1 hut with a single room. Back in Rome, life was again one room, all share 1 bed etc for most people. Add to that a few examples from their public activity: The poisoner Locusta (the world's first serial killer supposedly) was executed by being raped to death by a specially trained giraffe. Half their pottery is people being killed, the other half is sex scenes. Seriously. You think kids there didn't know what sex looked like? I don't know why people are shocked by this. It was the Victorians that brought in both the idea of privacy and the idea that sex was sinful and people should hide it. If you're going to argue for more restrictions on porn, you need to argue from first principles and evidence. You can't harken back to an imaginary time when no one knew where babies came from until the priest told them on their wedding night...
    - bluGill 6y ago
      Most families had someone who could read during the enlightenment. It is a simple and useful skill. They probably were not as good as modern people, but the evidence is reading was not as uncommon as we think. Christans have always had the idea of sexual privacy, something they inherited from the Jews. We have plenty of writing from early Christians that make it clear that they objected to how open the Romans were. The Victorians might have invented the idea that sex is sinful, but no religion surrives long if there are no children, so I'm not sure how common that belief was. (The shakers of course did have that belief and did well for a few years. I'm not aware of other groups with such beliefs, though I'd be surprised if they were alone)
      - busythrowaway22 6y ago
        "Christans have always had the idea of sexual privacy, something they inherited from the Jews. We have plenty of writing from early Christians that make it clear that they objected to how open the Romans were." I would like to add more to this. With the fall of Roman Empire, the early Dark and Middle Ages changed perspectives on nudity because of paganism. Most ruins and statues were seen as symbols of idolatry. This view slowly changed with the Renaissance period, as the Catholic Church embraced perspective that man is the image of God. Many famous sculptures and paintings were made in this period. These artistic works then became censored because of the Council of Trent. The Catholic Church had to implement changes because of Protestant Reformation. This is why many classical works of art have fig leaves. Michelangelo had to come back to his Sistine Chapel painting to censor it, for example.
- sweeneyrod 6y ago
  I don't think this is true. "copulation normally conducted in privacy" is a human universal http://joelvelasco.net/teaching/2890/brownlisthumanuniversals.pdf http://joelvelasco.net/teaching/2890/brownlisthumanuniversal...

LatteLazy 6y ago

200 years ago, those 10 year olds would have seen their parents at it pretty regularly. 2000 years ago, they'd have seen everyone in the tribe with their partners.

sushid 6y ago
Are you sure about that? Your claim is that folks during the Enlightenment just regularly wanted into their parents having sex. And moreover you're equating porn to walking in your parents. And you're saying people in ancient Rome saw everyone in their "tribe" going at it? You do realize that humans weren't cavemen 2000 years ago, right? Ancient Rome/China/etc. had prostitutes and brothels 2000 years ago.
- LatteLazy 6y ago
  Folks during the enlightenment were mostly illiterate peasants. Try keeping your sex life a secret when you, your brother, your wives, your parents and 6 kids/orphans all share 1 hut with a single room. Back in Rome, life was again one room, all share 1 bed etc for most people. Add to that a few examples from their public activity: The poisoner Locusta (the world's first serial killer supposedly) was executed by being raped to death by a specially trained giraffe. Half their pottery is people being killed, the other half is sex scenes. Seriously. You think kids there didn't know what sex looked like? I don't know why people are shocked by this. It was the Victorians that brought in both the idea of privacy and the idea that sex was sinful and people should hide it. If you're going to argue for more restrictions on porn, you need to argue from first principles and evidence. You can't harken back to an imaginary time when no one knew where babies came from until the priest told them on their wedding night...
  - bluGill 6y ago
    Most families had someone who could read during the enlightenment. It is a simple and useful skill. They probably were not as good as modern people, but the evidence is reading was not as uncommon as we think. Christans have always had the idea of sexual privacy, something they inherited from the Jews. We have plenty of writing from early Christians that make it clear that they objected to how open the Romans were. The Victorians might have invented the idea that sex is sinful, but no religion surrives long if there are no children, so I'm not sure how common that belief was. (The shakers of course did have that belief and did well for a few years. I'm not aware of other groups with such beliefs, though I'd be surprised if they were alone)
    - busythrowaway22 6y ago
      "Christans have always had the idea of sexual privacy, something they inherited from the Jews. We have plenty of writing from early Christians that make it clear that they objected to how open the Romans were." I would like to add more to this. With the fall of Roman Empire, the early Dark and Middle Ages changed perspectives on nudity because of paganism. Most ruins and statues were seen as symbols of idolatry. This view slowly changed with the Renaissance period, as the Catholic Church embraced perspective that man is the image of God. Many famous sculptures and paintings were made in this period. These artistic works then became censored because of the Council of Trent. The Catholic Church had to implement changes because of Protestant Reformation. This is why many classical works of art have fig leaves. Michelangelo had to come back to his Sistine Chapel painting to censor it, for example.
sweeneyrod 6y ago
I don't think this is true. "copulation normally conducted in privacy" is a human universal http://joelvelasco.net/teaching/2890/brownlisthumanuniversals.pdf http://joelvelasco.net/teaching/2890/brownlisthumanuniversal...