7 ms·

How long until their registrar or nameserver provider bounces them, too?.. how upstream will this go?

mopsi 6y ago
A few days ago the head of the largest flight attendant union called for all protesters to be banned from flights home: https://www.pbs.org/newshour/live-update/pro-trump-mob-breaches-u-s-capitol/association-of-flight-attendants-president-says-violent-protesters-should-be-banned-from-flying https://www.pbs.org/newshour/live-update/pro-trump-mob-breac... I don't like where this is heading. China has blocked millions of “discredited” travellers from buying plane or train tickets as part of the country’s controversial “social credit” system aimed at improving the behaviour of citizens. - https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/01/china-bans-23m-discredited-citizens-from-buying-travel-tickets-social-credit-system https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/01/china-bans-23m...
- el_nahual 6y ago
  Of all the bans, placing people who were at a violent, anti-government "protest" on the no-fly list actually seems like the most defensible one.
  - ridaj 6y ago
    Not without due process.
    - koolba 6y ago
      Which is the core problem with the no fly list. Most times people don’t even know they’re on it till they try to fly, and even then they don’t know why.
  - lhball 6y ago
    Granted, but how long until its used as precedent to put you on a list?
    - akhilcacharya 6y ago
      It's far too early to discuss "precedent" when there's literally no precedent for a lame-duck President inciting an insurrection against the legislature for certifying his loss in this country. I'll get concerned the second time it happens. But these are extraordinary circumstances.
  - radley 6y ago
    I believe the request was made due to the protestors causing problems on the flights: On an American Airlines flight from Dallas, a large contingent of Trump supporters got in an angry yelling match with other passengers after one of the president’s supporters projected “Trump 2020” on the cabin ceiling and walls.
  - nsxwolf 6y ago
    Nearly all the people there were just walking around outside.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
    - amanaplanacanal 6y ago
      True, but the article talks about the violent protesters, not the non-violent ones.
  - nijave 6y ago
    Except these lists have been historically difficult to contest or even figure out if you've been added to one. >You should know that the government’s summary likely will not include all of its reasons for your placement on the list, and in some cases the government will choose not to provide any summary at all. The government also will not provide you any of the evidence it relied upon in deciding to place you on the list, and it may also withhold information in its possession that undercuts its basis for putting you on the list. Finally, the government does not provide a live hearing at which you could testify or give you an opportunity to cross-examine witnesses against you. https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/what-do-if-you-think-youre-no-fly-list/ https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/what-do-if-you-think-y...
- kody 6y ago
  Terrorists are usually added to no-fly lists, yeah?
  - Mountain_Skies 6y ago
    When did you become the official judge of who is a terrorist? What happens when you're walking to the store one day, a protest passes by, and you no longer can fly ever again because you were identified on camera in a protest? "But I was just talking to the store!" Sorry, you cannot defend yourself against this because there no longer is any due process. You were on camera and that's the entire process. That part of your life that involves flying is now over regardless of your (non-existent) level of involvement in the protest. You really should be careful what you wish for because at this rate, you're probably going to get it and much more of it than you ever imagined.
    - kody 6y ago
      Edit: the no-fly list as a DHS entity, which I just learned about, is absolute horseshit. I assumed no-fly lists were per airline and I stand corrected. Terrorism is an over-applied label that is used to stoke FUD and expand executive power; yep I agree with that and I don’t use the term lightly. Joining an organized movement to overturn a legal democratic election, breaking into the capitol, armed, and bludgeoning an officer to death is terrorism and a private company has every right to deny these people the privilege of flying on their airlines.
      - yew 6y ago
        The no-fly list is an important element of suppressing terrorism, foreign and domestic. It exists to prevent precisely this sort of situation - very few of these people were from within driving distance of Washington (or each other). Whether it could do with more oversight is an independent question, with no shortage of people to ask it.
- jiqiren 6y ago
  Is there honestly a struggle to tell the difference between a private company and a government? banning rioters from a plane doesn't seem unreasonable. they are not a protected class.
  - nostromo 6y ago
    If the past 12 months has taught me anything it’s that one man’s protest is another man’s riot.
    - ridaj 6y ago
      Also, false equivalencies are stubborn... A powerful political figure (the effing outgoing prez) whips up a crowd to invade Congress (not just any federal property) while a critical session is in progress, with armed nut jobs announcing they're here to kill lawmakers and the veep. I don't see anything coming nearly close in recent memory. Professional whataboutists are even out there claiming this was an antifa false flag...
    - x86_64Ubuntu 6y ago
      But we are considering the goals and motivations of Team Parler/Stop The Steal, and it's clear that they aren't the victim in all of this.
- silexia 6y ago
  A private business can choose to do business with anyone they choose or to not do business with you. It would be different if the government was making these sorts of decisions.
  - nsxwolf 6y ago
    The number of exceptions to that supposed right are so numerous it’s almost not worth discussing.
    - amanaplanacanal 6y ago
      Actually it's not that long a list: U.S. federal law protects individuals from discrimination or harassment based on the following nine protected classes: sex, race, age, disability, color, creed, national origin, religion, or genetic information (added in 2008).
- davesque 6y ago
  The most extreme elements of the Trump movement basically proved themselves to be not much different than Al Qaeda on Wednesday. Given that, it seems perfectly appropriate to not allow them onto airplanes.
  - ars 6y ago
    Is that some kind of sick joke? Al Qaeda burns people to death in metal cages. The Trump riot was basically people taking stupid selfies. They were very violent to the building. But I've not seen any violence toward other people.
    - davesque 6y ago
      > But I've not seen any violence toward other people. Goodness, then you haven't been looking very hard. Perhaps you haven't seen this? https://youtu.be/cJOgGsC0G9U?t=1224 https://youtu.be/cJOgGsC0G9U?t=1224 The NYTimes also ran this story today: https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/09/us/pelosi-threat-Cleveland-Grover-Meredith.html https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/09/us/pelosi-threat-Clevelan... > Is that some kind of sick joke? Al Qaeda burns people to death in metal cages. Hate groups in the US have a long history of committing heinous murders and lynchings. Here's one such example which seems on par with your description of burnings in metal cages: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynching_of_Jesse_Washington https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynching_of_Jesse_Washington I don't doubt that there are members of hate groups in the US today that would commit such acts and that many of them are among Trump's most avid supporters; probably even among those that broke into the Capitol Wednesday. Let's please not pretend like that kind of violence isn't possible in Trump's America. Let's also not forget Trump's own personal legacy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Trump#1927_arrest https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Trump#1927_arrest
      - ars 6y ago
        Look, what they did at the capitol was abhorrent. > Perhaps you haven't seen this? You have got to be kidding me - some people shoving riot police is comparable to burning people alive in metal cages? The people in the front are not even hitting the police, they are just pushing. > Hate groups in the US Why are we switching to other groups suddenly? > I don't doubt So basically you are making up imaginary things, then assuming people will do them? > Trump's own personal legacy A story about his father is somehow relevant? Look, I will say it again, what they did at the capitol was abhorrent. But your comparison with Al Qaeda is indescribably worse. I'm utterly stunned to be having this conversation with you - it's like I'm living in some kind of alternate reality world. Aee you serious? Do you have even the remotest idea just how disgusting your comparison is?
- fangpenlin 6y ago
  What we are seeing here now in US is nothing new in China. Censorship, cancel culture, and now high tech terrarium. It's all following the same culture revolution path. You only need to replace landlord with who ever you want to beat here. In the end, the farmers who supported culture revolution are the final victims. Million and million people died. It seems like human can't never learned a lesson from history. And it's a shame now US is more like China, not China becomes like US if you compares now vs 20 years ago.
  - octoberfranklin 6y ago
    Thank you for speaking up. > high tech terrarium I'm not familiar with this term, maybe it comes from a phrase that is difficult to translate? I searched Google for "high tech terrarium" but the links were all about gardening and farming.
jart 6y ago
Daily Stormer tested the limits of speech using Domain Name registrations and the answer was every organization beneath ICANN.

A few days ago the head of the largest flight attendant union called for all protesters to be banned from flights home: https://www.pbs.org/newshour/live-update/pro-trump-mob-breaches-u-s-capitol/association-of-flight-attendants-president-says-violent-protesters-should-be-banned-from-flying https://www.pbs.org/newshour/live-update/pro-trump-mob-breac... I don't like where this is heading. China has blocked millions of “discredited” travellers from buying plane or train tickets as part of the country’s controversial “social credit” system aimed at improving the behaviour of citizens. - https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/01/china-bans-23m-discredited-citizens-from-buying-travel-tickets-social-credit-system https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/01/china-bans-23m...

el_nahual 6y ago
Of all the bans, placing people who were at a violent, anti-government "protest" on the no-fly list actually seems like the most defensible one.
- ridaj 6y ago
  Not without due process.
  - koolba 6y ago
    Which is the core problem with the no fly list. Most times people don’t even know they’re on it till they try to fly, and even then they don’t know why.
- lhball 6y ago
  Granted, but how long until its used as precedent to put you on a list?
  - akhilcacharya 6y ago
    It's far too early to discuss "precedent" when there's literally no precedent for a lame-duck President inciting an insurrection against the legislature for certifying his loss in this country. I'll get concerned the second time it happens. But these are extraordinary circumstances.
- radley 6y ago
  I believe the request was made due to the protestors causing problems on the flights: On an American Airlines flight from Dallas, a large contingent of Trump supporters got in an angry yelling match with other passengers after one of the president’s supporters projected “Trump 2020” on the cabin ceiling and walls.
- nsxwolf 6y ago
  Nearly all the people there were just walking around outside.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - amanaplanacanal 6y ago
    True, but the article talks about the violent protesters, not the non-violent ones.
- nijave 6y ago
  Except these lists have been historically difficult to contest or even figure out if you've been added to one. >You should know that the government’s summary likely will not include all of its reasons for your placement on the list, and in some cases the government will choose not to provide any summary at all. The government also will not provide you any of the evidence it relied upon in deciding to place you on the list, and it may also withhold information in its possession that undercuts its basis for putting you on the list. Finally, the government does not provide a live hearing at which you could testify or give you an opportunity to cross-examine witnesses against you. https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/what-do-if-you-think-youre-no-fly-list/ https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/what-do-if-you-think-y...
kody 6y ago
Terrorists are usually added to no-fly lists, yeah?
- Mountain_Skies 6y ago
  When did you become the official judge of who is a terrorist? What happens when you're walking to the store one day, a protest passes by, and you no longer can fly ever again because you were identified on camera in a protest? "But I was just talking to the store!" Sorry, you cannot defend yourself against this because there no longer is any due process. You were on camera and that's the entire process. That part of your life that involves flying is now over regardless of your (non-existent) level of involvement in the protest. You really should be careful what you wish for because at this rate, you're probably going to get it and much more of it than you ever imagined.
  - kody 6y ago
    Edit: the no-fly list as a DHS entity, which I just learned about, is absolute horseshit. I assumed no-fly lists were per airline and I stand corrected. Terrorism is an over-applied label that is used to stoke FUD and expand executive power; yep I agree with that and I don’t use the term lightly. Joining an organized movement to overturn a legal democratic election, breaking into the capitol, armed, and bludgeoning an officer to death is terrorism and a private company has every right to deny these people the privilege of flying on their airlines.
    - yew 6y ago
      The no-fly list is an important element of suppressing terrorism, foreign and domestic. It exists to prevent precisely this sort of situation - very few of these people were from within driving distance of Washington (or each other). Whether it could do with more oversight is an independent question, with no shortage of people to ask it.
jiqiren 6y ago
Is there honestly a struggle to tell the difference between a private company and a government? banning rioters from a plane doesn't seem unreasonable. they are not a protected class.
- nostromo 6y ago
  If the past 12 months has taught me anything it’s that one man’s protest is another man’s riot.
  - ridaj 6y ago
    Also, false equivalencies are stubborn... A powerful political figure (the effing outgoing prez) whips up a crowd to invade Congress (not just any federal property) while a critical session is in progress, with armed nut jobs announcing they're here to kill lawmakers and the veep. I don't see anything coming nearly close in recent memory. Professional whataboutists are even out there claiming this was an antifa false flag...
  - x86_64Ubuntu 6y ago
    But we are considering the goals and motivations of Team Parler/Stop The Steal, and it's clear that they aren't the victim in all of this.
silexia 6y ago
A private business can choose to do business with anyone they choose or to not do business with you. It would be different if the government was making these sorts of decisions.
- nsxwolf 6y ago
  The number of exceptions to that supposed right are so numerous it’s almost not worth discussing.
  - amanaplanacanal 6y ago
    Actually it's not that long a list: U.S. federal law protects individuals from discrimination or harassment based on the following nine protected classes: sex, race, age, disability, color, creed, national origin, religion, or genetic information (added in 2008).
davesque 6y ago
The most extreme elements of the Trump movement basically proved themselves to be not much different than Al Qaeda on Wednesday. Given that, it seems perfectly appropriate to not allow them onto airplanes.
- ars 6y ago
  Is that some kind of sick joke? Al Qaeda burns people to death in metal cages. The Trump riot was basically people taking stupid selfies. They were very violent to the building. But I've not seen any violence toward other people.
  - davesque 6y ago
    > But I've not seen any violence toward other people. Goodness, then you haven't been looking very hard. Perhaps you haven't seen this? https://youtu.be/cJOgGsC0G9U?t=1224 https://youtu.be/cJOgGsC0G9U?t=1224 The NYTimes also ran this story today: https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/09/us/pelosi-threat-Cleveland-Grover-Meredith.html https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/09/us/pelosi-threat-Clevelan... > Is that some kind of sick joke? Al Qaeda burns people to death in metal cages. Hate groups in the US have a long history of committing heinous murders and lynchings. Here's one such example which seems on par with your description of burnings in metal cages: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynching_of_Jesse_Washington https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynching_of_Jesse_Washington I don't doubt that there are members of hate groups in the US today that would commit such acts and that many of them are among Trump's most avid supporters; probably even among those that broke into the Capitol Wednesday. Let's please not pretend like that kind of violence isn't possible in Trump's America. Let's also not forget Trump's own personal legacy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Trump#1927_arrest https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Trump#1927_arrest
    - ars 6y ago
      Look, what they did at the capitol was abhorrent. > Perhaps you haven't seen this? You have got to be kidding me - some people shoving riot police is comparable to burning people alive in metal cages? The people in the front are not even hitting the police, they are just pushing. > Hate groups in the US Why are we switching to other groups suddenly? > I don't doubt So basically you are making up imaginary things, then assuming people will do them? > Trump's own personal legacy A story about his father is somehow relevant? Look, I will say it again, what they did at the capitol was abhorrent. But your comparison with Al Qaeda is indescribably worse. I'm utterly stunned to be having this conversation with you - it's like I'm living in some kind of alternate reality world. Aee you serious? Do you have even the remotest idea just how disgusting your comparison is?
fangpenlin 6y ago
What we are seeing here now in US is nothing new in China. Censorship, cancel culture, and now high tech terrarium. It's all following the same culture revolution path. You only need to replace landlord with who ever you want to beat here. In the end, the farmers who supported culture revolution are the final victims. Million and million people died. It seems like human can't never learned a lesson from history. And it's a shame now US is more like China, not China becomes like US if you compares now vs 20 years ago.
- octoberfranklin 6y ago
  Thank you for speaking up. > high tech terrarium I'm not familiar with this term, maybe it comes from a phrase that is difficult to translate? I searched Google for "high tech terrarium" but the links were all about gardening and farming.

jart 6y ago

Daily Stormer tested the limits of speech using Domain Name registrations and the answer was every organization beneath ICANN.