3 ms·

We're only pretending. Saving face is critical when negotiating in the East. If we can let the mainland save face and it costs us little of importance, why act

by coryrc 6y ago

We're only pretending. Saving face is critical when negotiating in the East. If we can let the mainland save face and it costs us little of importance, why act otherwise? Also, Taiwan itself is not unified. Around a third want to unify with the CCP.

Jasonnor 6y ago
> Around a third want to unify with the CCP. I am from Taiwan. Where does the data for your sentence come from? As far as I know, the proportion of people who want to be unified with CCP is only 2.4%. Reference: https://esc.nccu.edu.tw/PageDoc/Detail?fid=7804&id=6960 https://esc.nccu.edu.tw/PageDoc/Detail?fid=7804&id=6960
- perennate 6y ago
  This is about cultural identity though. The link should be https://esc.nccu.edu.tw/PageDoc/Detail?fid=7805&id=6962 https://esc.nccu.edu.tw/PageDoc/Detail?fid=7805&id=6962 which shows 0.7+6.8 = 7.5% supporting eventual re-unification with 0.7% supporting immediate re-unification.
- coryrc 6y ago
  Isn't the KMT's position re-unification and has support of about a third of the electorate? Though there's clearly a strong shift in the last two years.
puppymaster 6y ago
and 35% of Chinese doesn't mind Taiwan independence. What is your point?
perennate 6y ago
The KMT does not want to eventually re-unify the PRC. They merely want to continue pretending to want to eventually re-unify with the PRC to maintain good economic relations. Because the PRC accounts for 28% of Taiwan's exports and 19% of Taiwan's imports (https://www.wto.org/english/res_e/statis_e/daily_update_e/trade_profiles/TW_e.pdf https://www.wto.org/english/res_e/statis_e/daily_update_e/tr...). Really hardly anyone in Taiwan wants to re-unify with the PRC, they have seen the genocide the fascist CCP is committing against the Uighur people in Xinjiang, if the CCP repeats this in Taiwan and exterminates or sterilizes millions of Taiwanese it would be devastating. Nobody wants to bear witness to genocide, but even more so, nobody wants to be a victim to genocide, so supporting re-unification would be senseless.
- coryrc 6y ago
  My understanding of opinion polls referenced here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_unification#Taiwan_(ROC) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_unification#Taiwan_(RO... States {polls consistently found 70% to 80% of all residents in Taiwan opposed to unification through CCP's "One country, two systems"} which means 20-30% are for it? I definitely don't know enough to know if people are pretending to want reunification or actually do.
  - perennate 6y ago
    Hm you're right, I checked https://jamestown.org/program/taiwan-opinion-polling-on-unification-with-china/ https://jamestown.org/program/taiwan-opinion-polling-on-unif... and https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3951560 https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3951560 and it seems the 30% supporting eventual unification claim is correct according to recent polling, with 11% supporting sooner unification (i.e. unify even if PRC still has a Nazi government). Edit: according to https://esc.nccu.edu.tw/PageDoc/Detail?fid=7805&id=6962 https://esc.nccu.edu.tw/PageDoc/Detail?fid=7805&id=6962 (which has a finer breakdown) the number is 7.5%, but the jamestown.org article links to data also collected by NCCU (but maybe a different group), so I'm not sure what the distinction is.

by coryrc 6y ago

Jasonnor 6y ago

> Around a third want to unify with the CCP. I am from Taiwan. Where does the data for your sentence come from? As far as I know, the proportion of people who want to be unified with CCP is only 2.4%. Reference: https://esc.nccu.edu.tw/PageDoc/Detail?fid=7804&id=6960 https://esc.nccu.edu.tw/PageDoc/Detail?fid=7804&id=6960

perennate 6y ago
This is about cultural identity though. The link should be https://esc.nccu.edu.tw/PageDoc/Detail?fid=7805&id=6962 https://esc.nccu.edu.tw/PageDoc/Detail?fid=7805&id=6962 which shows 0.7+6.8 = 7.5% supporting eventual re-unification with 0.7% supporting immediate re-unification.
coryrc 6y ago
Isn't the KMT's position re-unification and has support of about a third of the electorate? Though there's clearly a strong shift in the last two years.

puppymaster 6y ago

and 35% of Chinese doesn't mind Taiwan independence. What is your point?

perennate 6y ago

The KMT does not want to eventually re-unify the PRC. They merely want to continue pretending to want to eventually re-unify with the PRC to maintain good economic relations. Because the PRC accounts for 28% of Taiwan's exports and 19% of Taiwan's imports (https://www.wto.org/english/res_e/statis_e/daily_update_e/trade_profiles/TW_e.pdf https://www.wto.org/english/res_e/statis_e/daily_update_e/tr...). Really hardly anyone in Taiwan wants to re-unify with the PRC, they have seen the genocide the fascist CCP is committing against the Uighur people in Xinjiang, if the CCP repeats this in Taiwan and exterminates or sterilizes millions of Taiwanese it would be devastating. Nobody wants to bear witness to genocide, but even more so, nobody wants to be a victim to genocide, so supporting re-unification would be senseless.

coryrc 6y ago
My understanding of opinion polls referenced here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_unification#Taiwan_(ROC) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_unification#Taiwan_(RO... States {polls consistently found 70% to 80% of all residents in Taiwan opposed to unification through CCP's "One country, two systems"} which means 20-30% are for it? I definitely don't know enough to know if people are pretending to want reunification or actually do.
- perennate 6y ago
  Hm you're right, I checked https://jamestown.org/program/taiwan-opinion-polling-on-unification-with-china/ https://jamestown.org/program/taiwan-opinion-polling-on-unif... and https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3951560 https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3951560 and it seems the 30% supporting eventual unification claim is correct according to recent polling, with 11% supporting sooner unification (i.e. unify even if PRC still has a Nazi government). Edit: according to https://esc.nccu.edu.tw/PageDoc/Detail?fid=7805&id=6962 https://esc.nccu.edu.tw/PageDoc/Detail?fid=7805&id=6962 (which has a finer breakdown) the number is 7.5%, but the jamestown.org article links to data also collected by NCCU (but maybe a different group), so I'm not sure what the distinction is.