5 ms·

I'm usually for removing every bit of unnecessary chrome, but this strikes me as going too far. URLs aren't optional if we want to have a world wide web. Other

by neilk 15y ago

I'm usually for removing every bit of unnecessary chrome, but this strikes me as going too far. URLs aren't optional if we want to have a world wide web. Otherwise it's just AOL redux. If URLs become this thing that only experienced users know about (or that we allow naive users to forget about) we're losing something important.

VMG 15y ago
We are not losing something important. Right now my address bar says http://news.ycombinator.com/reply?id=2570690&whence=item%3fid%3d2570434 90% of this information is irrelevant to me. URLs aren't good against phishing also. Having to discern "facebook.com" from "faceboook.com" as a normal user is much too error-prone. Better mechanisms are needed here anyway.
- mixmax 15y ago
  and without the addressbar how will you navigate to news.ycombinator.com? How will you know what site you're on? How will you prevent me from doing some clever SEO to turn up in a google search for your bank before their own website so I can scam you? How will you be able to return to that site you liked but don't have the address for since the URL was hidden? How will you market and position your site if noone knows the URL? How will you do offline marketing if users don't know how to get to the URL you provided? I definitely think we're losing something important.
  - jonknee 15y ago
    > and without the addressbar how will you navigate to news.ycombinator.com? Using the same icon I used to get here today. > How will you know what site you're on? By the page title or by looking at the site, same as I do today > How will you prevent me from doing some clever SEO to turn up in a google search for your bank before their own website so I can scam you? The same as today, Chrome pops up a malicious site warning. > How will you be able to return to that site you liked but don't have the address for since the URL was hidden? Search. Same as today considering a fair number of users type URLs into Google as it is (facebook.com is one of the very top Google searches) > How will you market and position your site if noone knows the URL? Market by the URL, no one is suggesting you won't be able to use the URL to arrive at a site. It's just killing the always shown URL bar.
    - rjbond3rd 15y ago
      Icon?
      - jonknee 15y ago
        I have a row of favicons in my Chrome bookmarks bar (no bookmark titles, so it's just a row of icons). HN is one of them.
        Meai 15y ago
        Yes, we all just love to see the day when the web solely consists of a few dozen apps in everyone's browser. Buttons have no significant advantage over today's url bars. Pressing a single button, I get all the sites I recently looked at, my favorites, all sorted and easily accessible.
        jonknee 15y ago
        By your count it's at least 100% faster--a single click and I'm where I want to be. I also get by fine on my computer by having a dock of app icons. Similarly, it works well on my phone. It's not the end of the world.
    - Zev 15y ago
      How did you get the icon there in the first place?
  - sp332 15y ago
    Doesn't Ctrl-L show the URL bar? You can type one if you want to, but it doesn't show up all the time. Opening a new tab should do the same, and then hide the bar when the page is loaded.
  - VMG 15y ago
    > and without the addressbar how will you navigate to news.ycombinator.com? I didn't say you should never see the address bar. You can use the bar to access the location you want, but once you are at your destination, you don't need it anymore > How will you know what site you're on? Hacker News has a bright orange bar at the top. Facebook is pretty blue. I think the address bar is the least identifying piece of a website. > How will you be able to return to that site you liked but don't have the address for since the URL was hidden? If I forgot to bookmark it, I'll do what I do now: use google > How will you market and position your site if noone knows the URL? > How will you do offline marketing if users don't know how to get to the URL you provided? I don't want to lose the URL, I want to lose the address bar after you have accessed the site and you don't need to see it anymore.
nazgulnarsil 15y ago
how many of your friends telephone numbers do you actually know?
- 51Cards 15y ago
  Most of them, I'd say I have 30-40 memorized easily.
  - stanleydrew 15y ago
    Surely you must know you are way outside the norm.
    - seabee 15y ago
      No kidding, most people use actual phone books or their mobile phone equivalent. The key difference between phone numbers and URLs is that everyone recognises that phone numbers exist, or at least know they're meaningful.
- jodrellblank 15y ago
  How many websites do you meet the owner and talk to them first then if you like them, ask for them to text you their website address so you can add it to your contacts?
PaulHoule 15y ago
It bugs me. I get a few inquiries a day about pages on my web sites. There are a few million of them, so I can't be expected to know what they're talking about from a vague or even a detailed description. About 1 in 5 offer me a URL right away, maybe 3 out of 5 will give me a URL once I ask for one, and about 1 in 5 doesn't know what the heck I'm talking about. It's depressing to think that it's going to get even harder for people, in the beginning of the linked data era where URLs are becoming the universal namespace.

by neilk 15y ago

VMG 15y ago

We are not losing something important. Right now my address bar says http://news.ycombinator.com/reply?id=2570690&whence=item%3fid%3d2570434 90% of this information is irrelevant to me. URLs aren't good against phishing also. Having to discern "facebook.com" from "faceboook.com" as a normal user is much too error-prone. Better mechanisms are needed here anyway.

mixmax 15y ago
and without the addressbar how will you navigate to news.ycombinator.com? How will you know what site you're on? How will you prevent me from doing some clever SEO to turn up in a google search for your bank before their own website so I can scam you? How will you be able to return to that site you liked but don't have the address for since the URL was hidden? How will you market and position your site if noone knows the URL? How will you do offline marketing if users don't know how to get to the URL you provided? I definitely think we're losing something important.
- jonknee 15y ago
  > and without the addressbar how will you navigate to news.ycombinator.com? Using the same icon I used to get here today. > How will you know what site you're on? By the page title or by looking at the site, same as I do today > How will you prevent me from doing some clever SEO to turn up in a google search for your bank before their own website so I can scam you? The same as today, Chrome pops up a malicious site warning. > How will you be able to return to that site you liked but don't have the address for since the URL was hidden? Search. Same as today considering a fair number of users type URLs into Google as it is (facebook.com is one of the very top Google searches) > How will you market and position your site if noone knows the URL? Market by the URL, no one is suggesting you won't be able to use the URL to arrive at a site. It's just killing the always shown URL bar.
  - rjbond3rd 15y ago
    Icon?
    - jonknee 15y ago
      I have a row of favicons in my Chrome bookmarks bar (no bookmark titles, so it's just a row of icons). HN is one of them.
      - Meai 15y ago
        Yes, we all just love to see the day when the web solely consists of a few dozen apps in everyone's browser. Buttons have no significant advantage over today's url bars. Pressing a single button, I get all the sites I recently looked at, my favorites, all sorted and easily accessible.
        jonknee 15y ago
        By your count it's at least 100% faster--a single click and I'm where I want to be. I also get by fine on my computer by having a dock of app icons. Similarly, it works well on my phone. It's not the end of the world.
  - Zev 15y ago
    How did you get the icon there in the first place?
- sp332 15y ago
  Doesn't Ctrl-L show the URL bar? You can type one if you want to, but it doesn't show up all the time. Opening a new tab should do the same, and then hide the bar when the page is loaded.
- VMG 15y ago
  > and without the addressbar how will you navigate to news.ycombinator.com? I didn't say you should never see the address bar. You can use the bar to access the location you want, but once you are at your destination, you don't need it anymore > How will you know what site you're on? Hacker News has a bright orange bar at the top. Facebook is pretty blue. I think the address bar is the least identifying piece of a website. > How will you be able to return to that site you liked but don't have the address for since the URL was hidden? If I forgot to bookmark it, I'll do what I do now: use google > How will you market and position your site if noone knows the URL? > How will you do offline marketing if users don't know how to get to the URL you provided? I don't want to lose the URL, I want to lose the address bar after you have accessed the site and you don't need to see it anymore.

nazgulnarsil 15y ago

how many of your friends telephone numbers do you actually know?

51Cards 15y ago
Most of them, I'd say I have 30-40 memorized easily.
- stanleydrew 15y ago
  Surely you must know you are way outside the norm.
  - seabee 15y ago
    No kidding, most people use actual phone books or their mobile phone equivalent. The key difference between phone numbers and URLs is that everyone recognises that phone numbers exist, or at least know they're meaningful.
jodrellblank 15y ago
How many websites do you meet the owner and talk to them first then if you like them, ask for them to text you their website address so you can add it to your contacts?

PaulHoule 15y ago

It bugs me. I get a few inquiries a day about pages on my web sites. There are a few million of them, so I can't be expected to know what they're talking about from a vague or even a detailed description. About 1 in 5 offer me a URL right away, maybe 3 out of 5 will give me a URL once I ask for one, and about 1 in 5 doesn't know what the heck I'm talking about. It's depressing to think that it's going to get even harder for people, in the beginning of the linked data era where URLs are becoming the universal namespace.