5 ms·

> Why on earth would you believe them? I don't! I'm just saying that this crazy printing is consistent with the current market. I also tell loud and clear to

> Why on earth would you believe them? I don't! I'm just saying that this crazy printing is consistent with the current market. I also tell loud and clear to stay away from them and to any exchange that wants you to be holding this shit. This doesn't mean that I swear off anyone working in crypto as a fraud like Tether. > Money printing is irrelevant (...) You're pointing at a system working Working for whom? For the ones that already have access to cheap capital? For companies in Wall Street that have enough money in their balance sheets to buy Uruguay or half the Mediterranean? For banks that should've been liquidated decades ago? Inflation rate is under the target? Oh great, so now all the small business owners will go bankrupt and not be able to afford the things they need at almost the same price they were before, and the rest of the unemployed people can just take their $600 checks to buy a PS5 to kill the time they will be spending at home. Yay, economics! > 10M to Pakistani NGOs rounds to zero. How about the 700M to Sudan? In any case, it's not the amount. It's the absurd "crypto is used by criminals and funds terrorists" claim while being completely blind for an obvious mechanism that is taking tax-payer money and putting in very questionable hands.

arcticbull 6y ago
> I don't! I'm just saying that this crazy printing is consistent with the current market. And every other bull market since Tether was formed, yeah. > I also tell loud and clear to stay away from them and to any exchange that wants you to be holding this shit. This doesn't mean that I swear off anyone working in crypto as a fraud like Tether. Tether is 80% of trading volume lol. The water is so murky you could build a hut out of it. There is no market without Tether. Not one that looks anything like you imagine it does. [1] > Inflation rate is under the target? Oh great, so now all the small business owners will go bankrupt and not be able to afford the things they need at almost the same price they were before, and the rest of the unemployed people can just take their $600 checks to buy a PS5 to kill the time they will be spending at home. Yay, economics! Ah now I see the issue. You've conflated fiscal, monetary, foreign and social policy into one abomination. This is your mistake. The Fed only manages the money supply. This is monetary policy. The Fed does this by increasing and decreasing the supply of money and managing interest rates and aims at a target 2% rate of inflation. It has done this incredibly successfully. Then there's fiscal policy - and by extension social policy. This is government spending on social programs and also on foreign aid. Businesses going bankrupt are being allowed to do so by bad fiscal policy and not bad monetary policy and no amount of crypto will change that. Only you voting will change that. That's not economics, that's fiscal and social policy. For instance, Canada is centrally banked, and doesn't have the issues you're pointing out because their fiscal policy was to provide everyone $2000 per month during COVID and is now paying small business rents. This is nothing to do with Bitcoin. And your NGOs and the Sudan. This is both a distraction, whataboutism, and also not monetary policy. This is foreign policy. This is nothing to do with Bitcoin. This would still happen with Bitcoin, of course, but bitcoin also opens up a new avenue on top of making the situation strictly worse. Please, learn about economics. Take an ECON-101 course. Stop trying to reinvent what you don't understand. I'm sure this is tough to hear because for many folks in the crypto space a whole lot of their identity gets wrapped up in crypto. > Not every crypto project is a fraud. No, but most of them are. And the ones that aren't don't solve anything better than a classical solution because trust is a huge optimization. By all means, continue working on crypto. It's not illegal, its just, you know, not smart. But poor decisions tend not to be criminal! [1] https://coinlib.io/coin/BTC/Bitcoin https://coinlib.io/coin/BTC/Bitcoin (@konamicode, reference added here due to rate limit - I was referring to the "Money flow from/to Bitcoin in the last 24 hours" chart showing 12B of flow into Bitcoin was via Tether, out of a total of 15B).
- konamicode 6y ago
  > Tether is 80% of trading volume lol. This statement might need a reference to back it up.
  - arcticbull 6y ago
    Provided, thank you for the call out!
- rglullis 6y ago
  It's funny how you try to separate monetary/fiscal/economic policy in relation to the current scenario when it comes to the status quo, but you do not apply the same logic when it comes to crypto. For you, what the Fed does is completely separate from the interests of the financial elites, but what one disgraceful actor in the crypto system is enough to make everyone stupid? > Only you voting will change that. First, I don't vote in the US. Second, are you seriously this naive or did you mean this as a joke? > And the ones that aren't don't solve anything better than a classical solution because trust is a huge optimization. Ah! And here I see the issue you are having. No serious person working in crypto ignores the fact that trust helps. The point is that trust should be granular, not a binary property. Every project working on layer-2 networks is basically dealing with the issue of trust vs performance. Also, another issue is that too much of an optimization makes a system fragile to systemic shocks. It doesn't matter if it is the US, Canada, the EU or a Banana Republic: the response from every government in every crisis has always been to concentrate more power and to ask more of people. Ever bigger houses of cards are built and when they inevitably get blown over, the solution is to get more "optimizations" and to have more bureaucrats with no skin in the game responsible in defining "policies" for people they have nothing in common with, know nothing of their actual problems and have zero incentive to actually care - in fact, if they cared they might end up losing their election or dead by going against the interests of the bigger fish. When you say that "10M going to Pakistan would also happen in Bitcoin" is missing the point. Money laundering/fraud/tax evasion/mismanagement of public funds will always exist, no matter what. The problem is that a Big central Government is not only be terrible at fighting it, the bigger it gets the more they create it themselves. You keep telling me to "take a econ course", as you think that my issue is not understanding the logic defended by economists. Far from it. Simply put, I want Homo Economicus logic to go extinct. Too many basic failed moral and ethical principles are built on "logic" backed by economists. Too many "optimizations" proposed by economists made our societies worse. Too much power was taken away from the people and put in the hands of "experts" - which seem a good thing "on average" but in reality made us more unequal, more polarized and less connected. When people get inevitably screwed over by Tether, there will be a bubble burst and lots of fools (not for lack of warning) will lose their money. Crypto will go on. It's their money they lost, the system as a whole survives and actually becomes stronger. Can you say the same about Government? Do people trust the government more or less after each crisis? I said in our last exchange as well: I am not the only one that works on crypto without caring about price. Making money is just a nice side-effect. The main motivation (to me at least[0]) is to build the tools that can let people be in charge of their actions including who/when to trust and delegate things . [1] [0]: https://hub20.io/architecture/#economies-of-scale-vs-robustness-of-decentralization [1]: https://trustlines.network

arcticbull 6y ago

> I don't! I'm just saying that this crazy printing is consistent with the current market. And every other bull market since Tether was formed, yeah. > I also tell loud and clear to stay away from them and to any exchange that wants you to be holding this shit. This doesn't mean that I swear off anyone working in crypto as a fraud like Tether. Tether is 80% of trading volume lol. The water is so murky you could build a hut out of it. There is no market without Tether. Not one that looks anything like you imagine it does. [1] > Inflation rate is under the target? Oh great, so now all the small business owners will go bankrupt and not be able to afford the things they need at almost the same price they were before, and the rest of the unemployed people can just take their $600 checks to buy a PS5 to kill the time they will be spending at home. Yay, economics! Ah now I see the issue. You've conflated fiscal, monetary, foreign and social policy into one abomination. This is your mistake. The Fed only manages the money supply. This is monetary policy. The Fed does this by increasing and decreasing the supply of money and managing interest rates and aims at a target 2% rate of inflation. It has done this incredibly successfully. Then there's fiscal policy - and by extension social policy. This is government spending on social programs and also on foreign aid. Businesses going bankrupt are being allowed to do so by bad fiscal policy and not bad monetary policy and no amount of crypto will change that. Only you voting will change that. That's not economics, that's fiscal and social policy. For instance, Canada is centrally banked, and doesn't have the issues you're pointing out because their fiscal policy was to provide everyone $2000 per month during COVID and is now paying small business rents. This is nothing to do with Bitcoin. And your NGOs and the Sudan. This is both a distraction, whataboutism, and also not monetary policy. This is foreign policy. This is nothing to do with Bitcoin. This would still happen with Bitcoin, of course, but bitcoin also opens up a new avenue on top of making the situation strictly worse. Please, learn about economics. Take an ECON-101 course. Stop trying to reinvent what you don't understand. I'm sure this is tough to hear because for many folks in the crypto space a whole lot of their identity gets wrapped up in crypto. > Not every crypto project is a fraud. No, but most of them are. And the ones that aren't don't solve anything better than a classical solution because trust is a huge optimization. By all means, continue working on crypto. It's not illegal, its just, you know, not smart. But poor decisions tend not to be criminal! [1] https://coinlib.io/coin/BTC/Bitcoin https://coinlib.io/coin/BTC/Bitcoin (@konamicode, reference added here due to rate limit - I was referring to the "Money flow from/to Bitcoin in the last 24 hours" chart showing 12B of flow into Bitcoin was via Tether, out of a total of 15B).

konamicode 6y ago
> Tether is 80% of trading volume lol. This statement might need a reference to back it up.
- arcticbull 6y ago
  Provided, thank you for the call out!
rglullis 6y ago
It's funny how you try to separate monetary/fiscal/economic policy in relation to the current scenario when it comes to the status quo, but you do not apply the same logic when it comes to crypto. For you, what the Fed does is completely separate from the interests of the financial elites, but what one disgraceful actor in the crypto system is enough to make everyone stupid? > Only you voting will change that. First, I don't vote in the US. Second, are you seriously this naive or did you mean this as a joke? > And the ones that aren't don't solve anything better than a classical solution because trust is a huge optimization. Ah! And here I see the issue you are having. No serious person working in crypto ignores the fact that trust helps. The point is that trust should be granular, not a binary property. Every project working on layer-2 networks is basically dealing with the issue of trust vs performance. Also, another issue is that too much of an optimization makes a system fragile to systemic shocks. It doesn't matter if it is the US, Canada, the EU or a Banana Republic: the response from every government in every crisis has always been to concentrate more power and to ask more of people. Ever bigger houses of cards are built and when they inevitably get blown over, the solution is to get more "optimizations" and to have more bureaucrats with no skin in the game responsible in defining "policies" for people they have nothing in common with, know nothing of their actual problems and have zero incentive to actually care - in fact, if they cared they might end up losing their election or dead by going against the interests of the bigger fish. When you say that "10M going to Pakistan would also happen in Bitcoin" is missing the point. Money laundering/fraud/tax evasion/mismanagement of public funds will always exist, no matter what. The problem is that a Big central Government is not only be terrible at fighting it, the bigger it gets the more they create it themselves. You keep telling me to "take a econ course", as you think that my issue is not understanding the logic defended by economists. Far from it. Simply put, I want Homo Economicus logic to go extinct. Too many basic failed moral and ethical principles are built on "logic" backed by economists. Too many "optimizations" proposed by economists made our societies worse. Too much power was taken away from the people and put in the hands of "experts" - which seem a good thing "on average" but in reality made us more unequal, more polarized and less connected. When people get inevitably screwed over by Tether, there will be a bubble burst and lots of fools (not for lack of warning) will lose their money. Crypto will go on. It's their money they lost, the system as a whole survives and actually becomes stronger. Can you say the same about Government? Do people trust the government more or less after each crisis? I said in our last exchange as well: I am not the only one that works on crypto without caring about price. Making money is just a nice side-effect. The main motivation (to me at least[0]) is to build the tools that can let people be in charge of their actions including who/when to trust and delegate things . [1] [0]: https://hub20.io/architecture/#economies-of-scale-vs-robustness-of-decentralization [1]: https://trustlines.network