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I can't comprehend why an average civilian would need a gun. None of the arguments seem to stack up, at least, from my perspective. Not trying to mock you, jus

by 4ggr0 6y ago

I can't comprehend why an average civilian would need a gun. None of the arguments seem to stack up, at least, from my perspective. Not trying to mock you, just seems like we have the same argument for our opposing views :)

SftwreEngnr 6y ago
Yes you are. At least admit something if you believe it.
GiorgioG 6y ago
You might change your mind if you’ve ever had someone try to break into your home at 3am. Happened when I was a kid. Fortunately my father had a lowly 0.22 rifle. The sight of the rifle in my fathers’s hands was enough to convince them to leave. My father is as left-leaning as they come (and an Italian immigrant) but he knew even then that the police can’t always protect you.
- 4ggr0 6y ago
  Yeah, I hear about a lot of examples like yours. I have an air rifle laying around somewhere, maybe that could scare someone off :D I was raised by the standards of "Talk or Run away", and I want to adhere to them. But I don't live in the US and in my country I don't have to be afraid to be home-invaded, especially not with guns. I see that some people "need" guns, I just don't want that as a pacifist. To each their own I guess ;)
erdos4d 6y ago
I don't get why there is a need in a city, but there are definitely wilderness places in the US where it is required. What's wacky is that nobody can see this difference when laws get passed.
- jdanp 6y ago
  Most major cities have additional gun restrictions compared to surrounding suburban/rural areas.
  - OminousWeapons 6y ago
    Parent's post is correctly insinuating that it's city people assuming their context is universal and trying to regulate as such. The state wide restrictions are non-sensical for rural environments in states like CA and MA.
jackhack 6y ago
why? Because the history books and graveyards (marked and unmarked) are full of examples of hundreds of millions of unarmed powerless peoples being marched off to their deaths by power-hungry dictators and their supporters. The authors of the American political system were exceedingly well educated and understood that a new American constitutional republic experiment where the people held the power would revert to a dictatorship unless the people themselves had some mechanism to retain authority. In addition to the checks and balances in the government, a large part of that authority is established (and guaranteed) through the availability of militarily-useful firearms as a last resort.
- 4ggr0 6y ago
  I guess the first problem is, that I am not from the US. What you write makes sense, but it seems weird to me to justify having guns with a hypothetical, apocalyptical scenario. Sounds a bit like fear-mongering to me. It's probably a cultural thing.
  - jackhack 6y ago
    Yes, it is precisely a cultural thing. America was formed as colonies declaring war against the strongest empire on earth, refusing to be ruled by a King and both occupied locally and abused from afar. The US Constitution and the balance of power between the three branches is designed to prevent consolidation of power in any one person because the government gains it's authority from the consent of the governed. (the people) And yes, as a final check against abuse of that power, the people have the means to overthrow. It is essential if free people are to remain free. Most things seem hypothetical until they happen. Hundreds of millions of dead souls in the last century died from what was (at the time) a "hypothetical, apocalyptical scenario." And not only the death camps - think of how many people started their day normally, never knowing they would be murdered by a government by nightfall. History repeats itself so long as the basic flaws of human nature persist - and they will.
hnlurker 6y ago
Try being a 5' 100# woman walking home alone at night. Technology, in the form of a reliable and compact weapon, is the best way for her to bridge the very real divide of physical size and strength against her most likely attacker. I know it's 2021 and it's sacrilege to even mention that men and women differ in very real and impactful ways, but.. there it is.

by 4ggr0 6y ago

SftwreEngnr 6y ago

Yes you are. At least admit something if you believe it.

GiorgioG 6y ago

You might change your mind if you’ve ever had someone try to break into your home at 3am. Happened when I was a kid. Fortunately my father had a lowly 0.22 rifle. The sight of the rifle in my fathers’s hands was enough to convince them to leave. My father is as left-leaning as they come (and an Italian immigrant) but he knew even then that the police can’t always protect you.

4ggr0 6y ago
Yeah, I hear about a lot of examples like yours. I have an air rifle laying around somewhere, maybe that could scare someone off :D I was raised by the standards of "Talk or Run away", and I want to adhere to them. But I don't live in the US and in my country I don't have to be afraid to be home-invaded, especially not with guns. I see that some people "need" guns, I just don't want that as a pacifist. To each their own I guess ;)

erdos4d 6y ago

I don't get why there is a need in a city, but there are definitely wilderness places in the US where it is required. What's wacky is that nobody can see this difference when laws get passed.

jdanp 6y ago
Most major cities have additional gun restrictions compared to surrounding suburban/rural areas.
- OminousWeapons 6y ago
  Parent's post is correctly insinuating that it's city people assuming their context is universal and trying to regulate as such. The state wide restrictions are non-sensical for rural environments in states like CA and MA.

jackhack 6y ago

why? Because the history books and graveyards (marked and unmarked) are full of examples of hundreds of millions of unarmed powerless peoples being marched off to their deaths by power-hungry dictators and their supporters. The authors of the American political system were exceedingly well educated and understood that a new American constitutional republic experiment where the people held the power would revert to a dictatorship unless the people themselves had some mechanism to retain authority. In addition to the checks and balances in the government, a large part of that authority is established (and guaranteed) through the availability of militarily-useful firearms as a last resort.

4ggr0 6y ago
I guess the first problem is, that I am not from the US. What you write makes sense, but it seems weird to me to justify having guns with a hypothetical, apocalyptical scenario. Sounds a bit like fear-mongering to me. It's probably a cultural thing.
- jackhack 6y ago
  Yes, it is precisely a cultural thing. America was formed as colonies declaring war against the strongest empire on earth, refusing to be ruled by a King and both occupied locally and abused from afar. The US Constitution and the balance of power between the three branches is designed to prevent consolidation of power in any one person because the government gains it's authority from the consent of the governed. (the people) And yes, as a final check against abuse of that power, the people have the means to overthrow. It is essential if free people are to remain free. Most things seem hypothetical until they happen. Hundreds of millions of dead souls in the last century died from what was (at the time) a "hypothetical, apocalyptical scenario." And not only the death camps - think of how many people started their day normally, never knowing they would be murdered by a government by nightfall. History repeats itself so long as the basic flaws of human nature persist - and they will.

hnlurker 6y ago

Try being a 5' 100# woman walking home alone at night. Technology, in the form of a reliable and compact weapon, is the best way for her to bridge the very real divide of physical size and strength against her most likely attacker. I know it's 2021 and it's sacrilege to even mention that men and women differ in very real and impactful ways, but.. there it is.