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They were never part of public debate. They were just talking amongst themselves, showing each other what they wanted to hear, and validating their own beliefs

They were never part of public debate. They were just talking amongst themselves, showing each other what they wanted to hear, and validating their own beliefs in a downwards spiral towards eventual extremism. This is enabled by the internet more than any specific social network. It's like sending someone to prison and expecting them to turn into a law abiding citizen: hard when all your peers are also criminals. Now the internet has essentially allowed such criminals to gather virtually and fester in their toxic ideas much in the same way a high school outcast may find they aren't alone when they get out of high school. One of the logical fallacies from pro-free-speech defenders of these people is the assumption that these ideas were organically developed. But I can assure you there is propaganda and foreign and domestic special interests that are intentionally shaping the thoughts and ideas from these people. I know in the Chinese community that interests like Falun Gong (an organization that believes extra-terrestrial Aliens are manipulating humans to intermix racially in order to subjugate us as well as other less-than-progressive beliefs like homophobia) have been heavily pro-Trump because of his anti-China policies, and they've been putting out a lot of toxic content aimed at Chinese-Americans [1] [2]. This is a disinformation war and taking actions like this is a part of war, otherwise services like Twitter are just complicit in aiding misinformation campaigns by one side. [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/01/07/trump-qanon-stop-the-steal-japan/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/01/07/trump-qanon-... - Falun Gong organized "Stop the Steal" protests in Taiwan [2] http://www.asahi.com/ajw/articles/14013938 http://www.asahi.com/ajw/articles/14013938 - Same Falun Gong protests in Japan

Anon1096 6y ago
>They were never part of public debate. They were just talking amongst themselves, showing each other what they wanted to hear, and validating their own beliefs in a downwards spiral towards eventual extremism. Isn't the exact opposite true as well then? If one side is siloed, by definition the other side must be in an opposite silo. You've taken it upon yourself to define that your side is in the "public debate" and therefore somehow isn't just "talking amongst themselves". Don't you see the issue here? Left Twitter/Reddit/Facebook absolutely exists, and they are not meaningfully conversing with the other side. And, if anything, having a sitting president on your side should by definition mean that you are "part of the public debate", since everyone at least hears the president's words (and especially Trump's).
- SV_BubbleTime 6y ago
  >If one side is siloed, by definition the other side must be in an opposite silo. You're right. And no offense specifically to anyone here, but he's trying to make his point somewhere with a specifically curated silo.
- chrischen 6y ago
  I'm not sure what side you think I'm on, but that's besides the point. I did not say what my side is, nor did I say that any other side is part of the public debate. A debate requires at least 2 opposing parties, so not sure what point you're trying to make. The point I am trying to make is that these people are not part of any debate, public or otherwise. There is flat out no "debate" happening because it's primarily involving a special group that has become the victim of internet and technology allowing the manipulation of information to control mass opinion. Nobody wants to have wasted their lives away playing Farm Ville, but Zynga's manipulation of technology sure is able to wrestle away that control from the common people. Likewise special interests were able to manipulate people at light speed by telling them exactly what they want to hear, and riling them up. Propaganda is in the very nature of communication and because of the internet it has allowed special interests to capture the attention of potentially millions and instill extremist ideas. For free speech to work propaganda must be employed and countermeasures must be employed. Free speech doesn't mean giving equal weight to all ideas, just like equality of opportunity doesn't mean making everyone equal all the time.

Anon1096 6y ago

>They were never part of public debate. They were just talking amongst themselves, showing each other what they wanted to hear, and validating their own beliefs in a downwards spiral towards eventual extremism. Isn't the exact opposite true as well then? If one side is siloed, by definition the other side must be in an opposite silo. You've taken it upon yourself to define that your side is in the "public debate" and therefore somehow isn't just "talking amongst themselves". Don't you see the issue here? Left Twitter/Reddit/Facebook absolutely exists, and they are not meaningfully conversing with the other side. And, if anything, having a sitting president on your side should by definition mean that you are "part of the public debate", since everyone at least hears the president's words (and especially Trump's).

SV_BubbleTime 6y ago
>If one side is siloed, by definition the other side must be in an opposite silo. You're right. And no offense specifically to anyone here, but he's trying to make his point somewhere with a specifically curated silo.
chrischen 6y ago
I'm not sure what side you think I'm on, but that's besides the point. I did not say what my side is, nor did I say that any other side is part of the public debate. A debate requires at least 2 opposing parties, so not sure what point you're trying to make. The point I am trying to make is that these people are not part of any debate, public or otherwise. There is flat out no "debate" happening because it's primarily involving a special group that has become the victim of internet and technology allowing the manipulation of information to control mass opinion. Nobody wants to have wasted their lives away playing Farm Ville, but Zynga's manipulation of technology sure is able to wrestle away that control from the common people. Likewise special interests were able to manipulate people at light speed by telling them exactly what they want to hear, and riling them up. Propaganda is in the very nature of communication and because of the internet it has allowed special interests to capture the attention of potentially millions and instill extremist ideas. For free speech to work propaganda must be employed and countermeasures must be employed. Free speech doesn't mean giving equal weight to all ideas, just like equality of opportunity doesn't mean making everyone equal all the time.