3 ms·

I'm confused. The Taycan range is ~200 miles. The LR Model 3 is 310, or 325 depending on when in 2019 they did the run. How does a car with 50% more range per

I'm confused. The Taycan range is ~200 miles. The LR Model 3 is 310, or 325 depending on when in 2019 they did the run. How does a car with 50% more range per charge take more time? Perhaps the Taycan they used could take a 270kW download and the Tesla only 150kW? It charged faster? Also, what is the calculus on optimal speed? Two factors substantially impact range on my Model 3: Speed and incline. Driving faster means stopping more often and 30 minutes of charge time at Cannonball speeds is going to be 45 miles lost. Gasoline pit stops could be under 10 minutes and much less impactful to optimum drive speed. I'd like to see the details of the speed driven at and the pit stops made by both the Model 3 run in 2019 and the Taycan run in 2020. It's not adding up.

bobobob420 6y ago
They could have just done a much more efficient cannonball on many factors. I’m sure it first had to beat the Tesla on paper for them to even attempt it which means theirs some calculation you could do yourself to prove it would be faster.
m463 6y ago
charging tapers off. It's quite possible to charge a 100kwh tesla next to a 30kwh leaf and have them both take the same amount of time. The trick to charging efficiently timewise is to start with an empty battery and charge to say 80%. Here's one of the best looks at this I've found: https://forum.abetterrouteplanner.com/blogs/entry/6-tesla-battery-charging-data-from-801-cars/ https://forum.abetterrouteplanner.com/blogs/entry/6-tesla-ba... the thing the graph doesn't show is % vs time, which would make it more clear. Also the graphs are old and don't show the newer higher-speed charging. Also, you could charge depending on the distance to the next stop, because overcharging could slow you down. It slows you down by taking longer to charge to higher charge levels, and also by not draining the battery low enough so the next charge will start closer to zero where charging is fastest. another unrelated but still interesting article is power consumption vs speed: https://forum.abetterrouteplanner.com/blogs/entry/22-tesla-model-3-performance-vs-rwd-consumption-real-driving-data-from-233-cars/ https://forum.abetterrouteplanner.com/blogs/entry/22-tesla-m... https://forum.abetterrouteplanner.com/blogs/entry/9-tesla-model-s-consumption-vs-speed/ https://forum.abetterrouteplanner.com/blogs/entry/9-tesla-mo...
- theluketaylor 6y ago
  Kyle Connor (one of the drivers) doesn't wait until anything close to 80% on runs like this. The moment the curve starts to drop they are off, charger hopping to maximize the charge curve. I think during their Telsa run the average charge time was around 8-10 minutes and the charge was rarely above 50%.
  - m463 6y ago
    There has to be a formula for this. You have to take into account: charging overhead - the time to get off the freeway, get to the charger and hook up. charging station choice. If there are two stations within a reasonable distance, sometimes pick the further one. unexpected over-consumption - drive too fast, headwinds, extra heater, having to detour. The tesla charging/nav algorithm doesn't always take this into account. Follow their program, but drive a little too fast and it will start telling you to slow down otherwise you won't reach your destination (depending)
tgsovlerkhgsel 6y ago
The Taycan being a sports car vs. the Tesla 3 being a entry-level electric car might have something to do with it.
theluketaylor 6y ago
There are a number of factors. * EPA range != real range. Porsche only did the 2 cycle test that has a 0.7 adjustment factor while Tesla does the 5 cycle test with no adjustment. Taycan has been shown to significantly beat its EPA range in a variety of conditions by nearly everyone who tests one (and is particularly good at high speed due to excellent aero). Teslas struggle to make their EPA range in nearly all conditions. * Taycan has an excellent charge curve, sustaining higher charge rates for longer than model 3 * Most US superchargers are 150 kW and Taycan can take advantage of most of the 300 kW (thanks to 800V) at the Electrify America stations * Traffic is low due to covid, so more opportunities to open it up Check the Out of Spec youtube channel as there will be a breakdown of the run coming (as well as details of the model 3 run from 2019). Kyle also discussed it in quite a bit of detail on the Smoking Tire podcast (also available on youtube). Kyle has said on a number of occasions up to about 120-130 mph it's better to drive faster, burning battery more quickly compared to driving slower and conserving battery.

bobobob420 6y ago

They could have just done a much more efficient cannonball on many factors. I’m sure it first had to beat the Tesla on paper for them to even attempt it which means theirs some calculation you could do yourself to prove it would be faster.

m463 6y ago

charging tapers off. It's quite possible to charge a 100kwh tesla next to a 30kwh leaf and have them both take the same amount of time. The trick to charging efficiently timewise is to start with an empty battery and charge to say 80%. Here's one of the best looks at this I've found: https://forum.abetterrouteplanner.com/blogs/entry/6-tesla-battery-charging-data-from-801-cars/ https://forum.abetterrouteplanner.com/blogs/entry/6-tesla-ba... the thing the graph doesn't show is % vs time, which would make it more clear. Also the graphs are old and don't show the newer higher-speed charging. Also, you could charge depending on the distance to the next stop, because overcharging could slow you down. It slows you down by taking longer to charge to higher charge levels, and also by not draining the battery low enough so the next charge will start closer to zero where charging is fastest. another unrelated but still interesting article is power consumption vs speed: https://forum.abetterrouteplanner.com/blogs/entry/22-tesla-model-3-performance-vs-rwd-consumption-real-driving-data-from-233-cars/ https://forum.abetterrouteplanner.com/blogs/entry/22-tesla-m... https://forum.abetterrouteplanner.com/blogs/entry/9-tesla-model-s-consumption-vs-speed/ https://forum.abetterrouteplanner.com/blogs/entry/9-tesla-mo...

theluketaylor 6y ago
Kyle Connor (one of the drivers) doesn't wait until anything close to 80% on runs like this. The moment the curve starts to drop they are off, charger hopping to maximize the charge curve. I think during their Telsa run the average charge time was around 8-10 minutes and the charge was rarely above 50%.
- m463 6y ago
  There has to be a formula for this. You have to take into account: charging overhead - the time to get off the freeway, get to the charger and hook up. charging station choice. If there are two stations within a reasonable distance, sometimes pick the further one. unexpected over-consumption - drive too fast, headwinds, extra heater, having to detour. The tesla charging/nav algorithm doesn't always take this into account. Follow their program, but drive a little too fast and it will start telling you to slow down otherwise you won't reach your destination (depending)

tgsovlerkhgsel 6y ago

The Taycan being a sports car vs. the Tesla 3 being a entry-level electric car might have something to do with it.

theluketaylor 6y ago

There are a number of factors. * EPA range != real range. Porsche only did the 2 cycle test that has a 0.7 adjustment factor while Tesla does the 5 cycle test with no adjustment. Taycan has been shown to significantly beat its EPA range in a variety of conditions by nearly everyone who tests one (and is particularly good at high speed due to excellent aero). Teslas struggle to make their EPA range in nearly all conditions. * Taycan has an excellent charge curve, sustaining higher charge rates for longer than model 3 * Most US superchargers are 150 kW and Taycan can take advantage of most of the 300 kW (thanks to 800V) at the Electrify America stations * Traffic is low due to covid, so more opportunities to open it up Check the Out of Spec youtube channel as there will be a breakdown of the run coming (as well as details of the model 3 run from 2019). Kyle also discussed it in quite a bit of detail on the Smoking Tire podcast (also available on youtube). Kyle has said on a number of occasions up to about 120-130 mph it's better to drive faster, burning battery more quickly compared to driving slower and conserving battery.